Published December 2, 2013
(Keep in mind as you read this that I have not been on this site for very long. Perhaps it takes a good while for a new member to experience a more friendly environment. Regardless, my first impressions have not been great. Yes, I received friendly messages on my wall. That's all very well and good, of course, but none of that friendliness really made it onto the reviews I received. So yes, I'm a bit bitter, but this is hardly the first time this has occurred and it certainly hasn't just been me. I've seen this sort of thing happen to anyone, all the time, and on any site (although the first few paragraphs may be specific to YWS, because of their review set up. Please do not think of me rebelling against the creators of this site. That's just ridiculous. Plus this is probably going to be the last thing I post on here, because I'm going back to deviantart for good after this)
..anyway)
No one cares about leaving a good review (if there are some, they are very few). All they care about is leaving enough lines on a work to literally get rewarded for their 'helpful criticism' by receiving points to publish what they do care about: their stuff.
It's hard to find someone that will even try, honestly. A person realizes they're out of points, they click the first story they see, regardless if its a genre they're experienced in, 'read' the work, and say what their minds have managed to piece together of the few lines they've skimmed:
Boring.
I didn't like it.
Could've done better.
I didn't understand it (no, I won't try to go over it again).
Sometimes it'll be more positive: 'good try, I guess'
Rude, mindless, thoughtless, and quite frankly, selfish. They don't do this for the sake of helping the writer, they do it for themselves.
Do you understand what power words have? As a self proclaimed writer one should have something of an idea.
What harm can it do? Oh friend, you have no idea. No, your three line stretch of the simple idea 'it was boring (to you)' carries much more weight than you imagine. It didn't mean much to you-of course it didn't. You spent two minutes reading the story and half a minute bothering to scribble down your payment for points.
But it can hurt. It can damage a fragile ego of someone that has just barely begun to dip their toes into the internet, daring to share someone that is precious to them. And you wreck what could have take months upon months of confidence-building and mustering-of-courage in a few words.
Not that you care, though. You've got your points, you get to post your next chapter. You've got dozens of admiring fans to please, I'm sure. What does some new, inexperienced author's self esteem matter to you?
Yes, people should be open to helpful critique (emphasis on helpful); It helps them improve, simultaneously bolstering their spirits and confidence about their writing.
"Wh..what?! A review that doesn't make a writer feel guilty about their writing?!" You ask, clearly shocked by this possibility. Surely it defies all laws of science? Why, you figured the only way to make a writer improve was to make them feel horrible about what they'd written. The guilt drives them to try again, right?
Nope. In fact if you ever thought that, you are a complete idiot and I hope I get the chance to slap you upside the head someday, because you are a waste of human flesh and I almost loathe your existence. Honestly, you could do so much better with your life, not that I'm going to tell you how. Why don't you act and appear the way I would prefer? You don't think the same way either, and the way you talk is boring and uninteresting. You should act according to my preferences. That's what I'm used to, so I'd like it better. And I assume (recklessly) that other people would too. Are you even trying? It doesn't seem like it.
Wow, after that speech, don't you just feel like immediately fixing yourself up? Don't you feel like thanking me for giving you such useful, in-depth tips about your life?
What? You don't? You feel angry? Sad? A little depressed, even? You're feeling an inner desire to reach through the internet and strangle me? You're barely focused on yourself, it would seem; except maybe feeling self conscious and a little embarrassed. Or just outright furious that I could even dare to suggest such a thing to you-you know you're not a waste of human flesh. Why am I even on the internet? I need to get off and get a life!
Funny. I thought if I bluntly and rudely told you what I thought of you, you'd find it helpful. After all, your breath stinks horribly and I don't even want to talk to you because of it.
Or I suppose I could just offer you a stick of gum, or point out quietly that you should probably remember to brush your teeth on more occasions. Or at least carry around some mints, whichever suits your fancy.
Strange, how subtly can carry a further, more useful impact than being outright blunt.
So did I make any sort of point here? Did any of this register, or do you just assume me to be some whiny brat incapable of taking a little comment? Surely anyone from anyplace with any amount of experience should be able to walk up to anyone else from anyplace with any amount of experience and say what they think, filter or no filter...
Well, they can. That's the thing. As much as I wish, there are certain people that I cannot tape shut the mouths of. Or tie their fingers together so they can't type stupid, useless 'reviews', I suppose. We'll all have to deal with some idiot somewhere that will take it upon themselves to decide to leave a blunt, cutting remark on a budding writer's work, not caring what affect it will have.
But can I cut myself off with one last suggestion?
If you're going to review someone's work, please at least try. Learn how to leave a proper critique. Work inside your favorite genre until you've become well read enough and/or open minded enough to venture into a different area, being mindful that you may not quite yet know enough about that particular brand to leave too critical of a review.
Because what may be boring to you may be fascinating for someone else. The world is full of a wide range of readers that like different types of stuff. Just because it doesn't suit your fancy doesn't mean someone else wouldn't love it.
(I for one couldn't get through the first few chapters of Lord of the Rings and that's an international favorite right there, so you know...just keep in mind not everyone likes the same stuff)
And please stay aware that even though you may be older than and/or written more than another author, that does not automatically make you better than them. Refrain from demeaning remarks. They will want to punch you.
(As ironic as this end note may be, I realize, I am not searching for critique on this. It's a rant. I really don't care if I made a grammar mistake, unless it's a serious one.
If you got offended by this, chances are you are guilty of leaving a crappy review. I'm not going to be responding to whiny, outraged comments claiming that you've been personally insulted.)
Points:
Time spent:
IP address:
Canary word: Present
Possible AI signals:
Original Text:
Are you sure you want to delete this comment? This cannot be undone.
Mark this comment as a review? Points will be awarded to the poster.
Your comment was posted, but it wasn’t long enough to count as a review. Reviews need about four complete sentences (at least 250 characters). Try writing another review that explains your thoughts in more detail — the author will appreciate it, and you’ll earn points for it.
137,563 Literary Works • 672,043 Reviews
Its really upsetting to know that you have had such a bitter experience. I do think that instead of leaving this site, you should write more. Write till you feel satisfied, don't write to please those people who have lost the ability to appreciate.
I'm a beginner too and I know how criticism can upset a young writer at times.
I truely understand what you are going through.
Like you mentioned in one of the lines, what seems boring to someone may turn out to be the most interesting literary piece to another.
Don't take such people seriously.
Keep writing
Take care.
Ps. Please ignore any grammatical errors.
Thankyou.
I personally find this article insightful and will be discussing it with other moderators.
However, a review does seem in order.
Actually, this feedback is very useful. Older member feedback is limited because they have invested a lot more time in the site and therefore leave with a lot more reluctance. New member feedback is very useful because it helps us learn what features are inviting and which features are intimidating. Which is why YWS Moderators are interested in hearing feedback from every member of the community, no matter how long they've been around.
On the literary side; I would advise against using language like "I haven't been around long" or "I'm a bit bitter," and rather just describe yourself as a new member that is frustrated by the low quality reviews you've received and seen others receive. This gives us a clearer vision of your concerns; with less rambling.
Ultimately, every action that humans undertake is because they believe it to be in their best interests to do. A sincere reviewer, for instance, may enjoy doing good reviews because it gives them a feeling of satisfaction. From this perspective, greed is present in every YWS reviewer, good and bad; and I would go further and say that it is a part of human nature itself.
The advantage of the point system is that it can make use of that greedy nature. If people want to post a new work, they must first write a review for someone else to get the points. The disadvantage is that the reviews don't have to be good quality.
On the literary side of things, this particular bit could have been solved by doing some more research. Sending a PM to a Moderator with your concerns and frustrations would have undoubtedly resulted in this post. With this information, you might even come up with an inventive solution, one which would work better than the current system.
What you say is true. Young writers can have a very fragile ego. However, those fragile egos are broken by both good and bad reviews. In fact, a critic that says "It sucks" can be easily dismissed as not knowing anything; but one that writes "It sucks because of..." and goes on to list every single fault that they can detect can absolutely level the self-confidence of any writer.
What is really awkward is that, more often than not, the reviewer in question is correct in most respects; which can be very embarrassing. Some reviewers do tone down their language; phrasing it to be helpful. However, when they do this, the effect might be that the author doesn't understand the gravity of their errors. Which is why harsh reviewers might agree with the statement "Sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind."
And even a softened critique may not be soft enough to spare a fragile ego.
From a literary point of view, this is another important topic which would have benefited from some research. A little bit of research would do more to inform you about the difficulties that new writers face, and perhaps given you some insight into a possible solution.
One way you might be able to focus this particular segment is to break it down into rhetorical questions something like: Is there a better way to develop supportive reviewers? It is certainly a question that would certainly captivate me.
I am not sure that this is helpful advice. When a reviewer writes a review, it is an opinion. The idea that other reviewers will have different opinions is a matter of complete indifference to the reviewer: what is important to a good reviewer is writing a detailed review that covers the style of writing, the content of the writing, and their overall impression of that writing.
Maybe what really needs to change is the focus of the author that submits their works. Maybe they should have to read a warning message that says "If you submit this work, there is a good chance that your work will be absolutely torn to pieces by experienced editors; editors that enjoy ripping literature apart; not unlike the way "The Predator" enjoys ripping the spines of its victims."
On a more literary note: it may be best to write the conclusion so that it summarizes your main arguments. These arguments aren't very clearly articulated, but I'll take a stab at it:
Overall, I thought this rant rambled quite a bit; but did succeed in raising some interesting points. Had you done more research, you could have probably changed it from a rant into a constructive critique of YWS reviewers. Although you mentioned that you were leaving, I do hope you will come back and take the time to consider these points and let me know what you think, either in the comments below, or via PM.
-Griffinkeeper
Hmmmm.
Well, I was on my way to look at these horribly demeaning reviews you spoke of, and all I see is this published rant in your portfolio. Which doesn't give me much to work with, really.
This is an assumption, one I encourage you to drop immediately. You're rounding all of YWS up in a bad opinion based on a few, if that much, bad reviews. Don't. YWS is full of reviewers who love to review for many reasons: to pass the time, to earn new stars, to earn points, to help the writer out, to improve on their reviewing skills for Review Days.
Okay, I can understand being angry about receiving an unhelpful and even rude review, but this scares me. This is a bit over the line, and if you do get like this, then I encourage you to step away from the keyboard and go for a walk.
We've all received rude reviews, including myself. I'll link you to one that really upset me, found here. Do you see how I handled it? I was upset, like you are. I wanted to yell at the guy and tell him off. But I held back. I walked away, talked about it with a friend, and came back with a leveled head. I reread the review and picked out the helpful stuff, ignoring the layer of rudeness disguised as fluff.
It happens to all of us. You get those reviewers that are brutally honest, because you know why they do that? Not because they're (entirely) rude or spiteful, but because they don't believe in sugar coating the truth. There is a fine line between helping the author by being truthful and belittling the author. Some people cross it unintentionally.
You've gotta learn to ignore the reviews that upset you. You've only stumbled across less than half of the reviewing community, my friend. Chances are, you'll soon come across a reviewer whose reviews aren't even helpful; just a bunch of fluff and "omg I loved your work write more write more pls" .. and then you'll come across the ones who spam (or point scrounge) for points. Those you report to the mods.
Overall, please don't let this discourage you from writing more. I do hope you decide to stay with us.
~Iggy
It breaks my heart to hear that you feel this way because a lot of us really do care. We spend time on each review and we don't review for points- we review because we love reviewing. We try to help. Yes, there are some who review for points, but not the whole site. I'm sorry you've had a bad first impression.
If you feel the reviews you get are not up to your standard, or just seem utterly pointless. Then you should be the change you want to see, and you should start making awesome reviews. Don't put everyone else down for a few reviews. Some here just do it for the points, but a lot of the time they try their best to give you great critique and try to improve your writing skills. You can sit here and rant about reviews not being great, and maybe you're right. But seriously, what does it solve? If I were you, I wouldn't leave the site, but do the exact opposite. Invest time and effort into making what you do on this site helpful, and you will in return receive helpful and good reviews.
If you're going to be mocking the reviews of others, you should probably make sure your own are at least above the standard you're claiming to uphold.
This article struck me as self-indulgent, not least because it sounds like you're upset that you posted a chapter that wasn't received well. Your reviewers noted it as boring, and rather than self-examine what you wrote, you instead critiqued what they wrote. You even went so far as to write an article bad-mouthing all reviewers on this site despite not posting any good ones yourself, and being a member for only a few weeks.
In fact, you're not even encouraging people to leave good reviews. You're instead encouraging them to leave reviews that lavish praise upon the author whether the work deserved it or not. That's a point you make particularly clear when you write:
Look, here's the thing: you have to separate yourself from your writing. Is that hard to do? Definitely. But if you want to improve as a writer, then you have got to look at your writing from a non-biased perspective. On here, you can at least get someone to read what you write and give you feedback. A literary agent, though, often only reads the first page.
Here's an article you may want to read:
What makes an agent stop reading
I think you may have lost some focus here. The idea isn't to critique the author or their personal views. Instead, it is to examine the article and judge the article on the merits of it's writing and arguments.
Don't argue with the writer, argue with the article. That's part of separating an author from their writing.
I disagree. The writer is arguing with her reviewers, and you are arguing with me.
Yo bro, I agree with you!
Especially the people who say "I don't understand Sorry" and leave it. However I feel that people being rude about it is the lesser problem.
The bigger problem is quite the opposite. Too many reviews I read are "I like it! it was good! Well done, but they give no critique, no help, some of them don't even say what they liked. Its completely useless and makes me cringe, especially on one instance where there was a writer who really needed improvement, who really desperately had to be told what was going on and everyone was so wuss to say anything and I had to go in there with the knife.
Now I'm not saying happy reviews are bad, they can be good, but when some peoples go in there and all they say was it was nice, its really not helping, and in some cases its worse off for the writer because they need to improve but they think its good.
I just thought that was another aspect you could have talked about.
I'm sorry to hear that you don't like the reviewers on this site. I will admit and say I haven't been around very long to experience anything you say will happen in the future. But really there are some well meaning people on here who truly do enjoy reviewing, who truly do mean well. But you can't expect everyone to sweeten there words just for your ego, if you can't take the reviewing then I believe it's best that you go back to a cheep place where no one will be truthful about your work.