Young Writers Society

If you just joined YWS, what do you find confusing about the site and/or needlessly complicated?

If you joined YWS after August 2009, what did you find confusing and/or needlessly complicated when you first joined?

If you joined YWS prior to August 2009, what do you find confusing and/or needlessly complicated about the new layout? Did the old YWS do anything better in making things easier?

If you joined YWS in August 2009, take your pick.

Also, if there was a YWS manual, do you think you'd give it just a quick look? It would be something very short, and not a word longer.



With all this, what I'm hoping to get at is a better understanding of how you use the site and if there's something I can do to make it easier. Over this upcoming summer, I'm going to be doing a lot in improving the site, but the problem is, the way I use the site and you use the site can be two very different things. For example, I used to be shocked that people actually clicked the "View New Posts" link.

I like the Novels & Novellas addition. I wonder if you could make that page a little more like the Featured Works/Front page? Seems the covers you worked so hard on don't really get to make much of an appearance. Might just be me but I sort of feel like with this section in place, there's no need for the separation of Novel forums and Short Story forums. It looks cluttered and you can't tell who last commented on what forum of which genre, if that makes any sense.

Having said that, I know it's not something you want to hear, given just how much work went into that separation. Overall, the site is so much better than before that it makes suggestions like the above seem petty - I think most comments from here on will be in the same vein, just little things.

One thing I liked a lot about the old YWS was the little text box that appeared beneath the titles in each forum, usually contained a tagline...that's just cos I like taglines

Ultimately, it's really hard to tell if this site is confusing or not because I've grown up with it. So much of it is instinctive now, the only thing that genuinely trips me up every now is the tab-change, sometimes I end up in blogs when I wanted My YWS, etc - that's just habit and laziness though. I'll admit to being a tad worried about growing clutter - there's a possibility that you could keep trying to patch this small error here, while adding on this new sparkly feature there, and trying to revamp that old corridor there, while fixing the carpet in the lounge room, only to realise the cable is out and the chat isn't working -- creating this Frankenstein-like mix of old and new...but I wouldn't know, because I'm on the inside. Not the out. You'll need new members feedback on that (probably why you asked, you mad genius you).

That being said, it's an unlikely scenario.
It's all seeming really shnazzy now and generally awesome.

If you joined YWS prior to August 2009, what do you find confusing and/or needlessly complicated about the new layout? Did the old YWS do anything better in making things easier?

Hm...I don't actually see anything as being particularly confusing or difficult to use. Maybe that's just because I already had a little experience with the old layout and the transition from one to the other was smoother for me. Not sure.

I'm looking at the old site right now, and, from the perspective of a newbie, everything is clear and straightforward. For example, the Help/Support dropdown thing. That's something that the new YWS layout doesn't have, but could definitely benefit from, I think. Especially for new members who may find it daunting or confusing to be a part of such a big site.

But other than that, I don't find it or see it being difficult to use. :/

Oh, and the Hall of Fame thing is so cool! We should do that again.

It's so hard to say, since I'm so used to everything. The only thing I can think of is that it might make more sense for "check your statistics" to be under the My YWS tab. And it took a few seconds for me to find where to view my profile, but that's just because the tabs moved recently, so I'll get used to it.

I like the new layot. Only thing about Novels and Novellas, I think we should be able to upload our own covers if we want

The only thing I really would like is an easier way of posting a reply in people's guestbooks.
I still find guestbooks awesome. ^.^

Besides that, I liked the little status things in blogs.

If you joined YWS prior to August 2009, what do you find confusing and/or needlessly complicated about the new layout? Did the old YWS do anything better in making things easier?

Blogs. The improvements about not refreshing the page when you go to a new page of blogs makes it mildly annoying to use. If you click on a blog on, say, page 3, read it, and just click "back", then you're right back on page one. This isn't bad if you're on pages 1, 2 and 3, but when you start flipping back past that it can get a bit annoying. Also, if you have a lot of blogs to read on page 2 (say you missed a day of YWS) then having to hit back, go forward a page, click a blog, repeat, gets a bit long.

Also, editing a post, especially a literary post, feels complicated. Namely, you cannot see any other comments made when you are editing a post. This gets the most annoying when you're editing a literary post, because you cannot just scroll down to see what people have commented on or any typos/clunky descriptions that are quick to edit they've pointed out. I've taken to editing my work in a new tab for this reason, and I tend to miss stuff because I'm switching tabs and lose my place too easily.

Also, if there was a YWS manual, do you think you'd give it just a quick look? It would be something very short, and not a word longer.

The slightly out of date YWS manual. Points 2—7 and point 9 need updating, but I could probably do that in an hour.

There is also Kamas' Questions to answers everyone has which gets referenced/linked a fair bit.

Rosey Unicorn wrote:There is also Kamas' Questions to answers everyone has which gets referenced/linked a fair bit.

If it helps, I'll happily make it more manual/FAQ like.


I'm so used to this site I can't really tell if it's confusing. I got used to the site quickly. It's all really simple, the thing is there are a lot of forums and such to explore Which could be confusing to someone brand new.

I guess my opinion might come in handy in a really weird way since I'm before 2009, but I didn't "grown into" the new site layout.

Granted, I love it to death. I want to give it hugs on a daily basis. But I do find myself going "I can't find this!" or "What on earth is that?" on a regular basis and running into the chat to ask a moderator about it. This could probably be solved if I skimmed through the information board, but it's just not something I want to do, and considering most new members won't learn things that way, I guess it's good I don't. (To be able to give my opinion from the view of a new-ish member.)

I don't necessarily find it confusing, I just find that there is a lot more stuff than there used to be. Both good and bad. All of the new stuff is good, but then it's bad because I don't know how it works. (Like the novel/novellas section. I was confused until someone sent me the video you made on it.) It's not stuff that (I think?) can easily be understood at a first glance, you need to read something about it or have someone explain it to you.

But is that bad? Probably not. If a new member is asking questions about things, they're making interactions, and as long as they can actually navigate the site to ask those questions, then the site is perfect. As long as the person answering the question doesn't say, "Wow, you are sooo dumb for not knowing this!" and is more encouraging, "There are a lot of great features on the YWS that are hard to understand at first, but feel free to ask me or others any time and we'll help!" Then it could definitely help keep new members because we do have a nice, personal staff around to help people.

Of course, like I said, I think it's hard to understand. I would not be surprised if new, younger members caught on easier than I did. I might be in college but if the structure of a cell confuses me, so will the layout of a website.

[adding this in...]

Just thought of something! Perhaps to remove asking all those questions (unless asking the questions is good communication between new/current members), you could have "how does this work?" links next to weird things that link to their specific post-explanations. Of course this might just leave you with a lot of "how does this work" links, haha. But it's a thought!

Hi!

Well I joined three weeks, maybe a month, ago. Most of the site is well done, but some of it has been confusing.

A manual would be very nice, because yesterday I ended up searching page after page before I finally figured out that a light green and dark green name means you're a moderator. (I needed a story moved, and I did finally find a moderator who helped me.) And there are a lot of little things like that which are very confusing to a new member, things that old members take for granted since it was so long ago they had to learn that.

Also, in the Find a Member, there should be a search box, instead of going alphabetical order. Just a thought.

Overall this is a wonderful site! I'm glad I found it, as I'm an aspiring writer (who on here isn't?).

LOVE --ULTRAVIOLET

Thanks everyone. Please keep the comments coming.

New Members: I don't care if you've been here for 10 minutes; I really want your input! As some have pointed out, it gets hard to know what's complicated and what isn't if you've been here for a long time.

Jasmine: I agree about uploading your own cover, and it's definitely in the works.

If you joined YWS prior to August 2009, what do you find confusing and/or needlessly complicated about the new layout? Did the old YWS do anything better in making things easier?

I liked the old layout. It looked much cleaner and less cluttered, though the new layout is more functional and easier to navigate. I have already suggested submenus to cut down on the clutter in the menu bar while providing easier access to certain areas of the site (like our Lit Comments made/received), though that would probably add to the complexity. >.>



Two words: Site Map. Actually, better make it three: Complete Site Map. In addition to having all the major areas of the site listed in some logical order (I think having clickable dropdown menu-thingies (the proper term eludes me; yes I did just use parentheses within parentheses) would be nice), there could also be quick descriptions of what each place is, so it would act as a handy, one-stop guide to the site. There could be two ways to organize it: by site navigation, and/or by feature. I will quite happily volunteer my services in compiling such a map should you ask demand them.

Another thing that would be nice is the ability to go back to the parent forum from a subforum like you can return to the forum that houses a thread. It's a bit annoying, for example, to have to go back up to the tabs to get to the Community forums from the Information Desk so I can go to the Nominations forum. And it would also act as a reminder of where each subforum is located. Being able to access subforums from their parent forums directly would also be great. For instance, I never could find the Nominations forum because I never remembered that it was located under Information Desk.

I also think that a more expanded YWS manual would be nice. Making a section of the site devoted to it (Like the old Knowledge Base) would be good, methinks, with an entire menu option devoted to it ("How to Use the Site"). The complete site map would, of course, be located here as an option on the dropdown menu. It should probably be the first option, else be made otherwise noticeable. The YWS manual would probably work best formatted as an FAQ-style list divided into a couple main categories (Submitting Work, Storybooks, Chat, etc.).

One thing I dream of but know will probably never come to be as it requires much coding is the ability for members to customize which modules appear on the home page. Perhaps, in the far future...? :3

And while I'm at it, I have another suggestion for badges. I think it would be a good idea if there were a badge for participating in the Information Desk (maybe call it the Kiosk badge?). People who consistently provide quality feedback on the new features/provide ideas to improve the site would be eligible, so it would act as an incentive for members to be more involved in this section of the site. More feedback is always good, right? :P I was also thinking of two more badges for the new News section: one for the blokes that comment on the articles (Commentator) and one for article writers (Reporter). Again, more incentive for continued involvement in the News section.

Ky, you do know that - as regards the parent forum, sub-forum suggestion - you can just go to the' Jump To' bar at the bottom of the screen and go to and from subforums and parent forums. At least, I can. I'd be surprised if you couldn't too.

Thanks Kyllorac.

On parent and subforums, I'm not actually quite sure why it's not already set up like you suggested. The default for phpbb3 (which is what YWS runs on top of) is that kind of set-up. I've tried fixing it in the past to no avail, but I'll look into it again soon. For now, though, Jiggity is right. The Jump To drop-down makes it easy to jump between related forums or any forum.

On novels and novellas from before, I've decided to neglect my studies for a few hours and try to make some fixes there.

Ky, you do know that - as regards the parent forum, sub-forum suggestion - you can just go to the' Jump To' bar at the bottom of the screen and go to and from subforums and parent forums.

I did not know that. :o That makes things so much easier. XD Though it probably should be made a little more noticeable and mentioned in the YWS manual.

The fixes with the Novels and Novellas forums are awesome, by the way, Nate. :D