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Why Isn't The Bible italicized or underlined?



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Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:32 pm
Aley says...



As a long work, it should be italicized or underlined, as a book it should be as well. The thing is, we don't. Our grammar is made up of what we have standardized over time, so for some reason, The Bible wasn't considered a book when that rule was made, not in the sense of other books. It had to stand apart along with the other holy books. Why is scripture just capitalized and not italicized?
  





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Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:35 pm
Pretzelstick says...



I honestly don't know. Maybe it isn't italicized because it's special and holy and it should be considered apart from any other books in the world!
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Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:49 pm
Aley says...



Well not any other... Other holy books get the same treatment, along with the books within those books. For example The Koran and The Torah aren't italicized either.
  





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Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:50 pm
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Tenyo says...



[Edited]
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Thu Feb 26, 2015 10:44 pm
LadySpark says...



Like Tenyo said, italics didn't exist back then! As for why we don't do it now, I would ask, why do we need too? Italics aren't always used in a piece of writing! They're used for thoughts (which from what I read in the bible, it doesn't really share the thoughts of someone, at least in the way we read them in contemporary fiction), and to place emphasis on something. Italics are quite contemporary, and the Bible is not. Hahahaha see what I did there? xD Anyway, I would say the reason is because 1. the Bible was written before the italics were invented and 2. because italics are a contemporary thing, and the Bible isn't technically contemporary.

Annndd like Tenyo said, underlines don't really have any place in professional works!
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Thu Feb 26, 2015 11:08 pm
Holysocks says...



I've always seen using italics for titles as a way to separate the titles from the rest of a sentence... so that it's obvious what the title is, and it doesn't all run together. The thing with The Bible, is that pretty well everyone knows what you're talking about, and it's become more of a direct noun than other books... not sure if that makes too much sense... If you said The Book Thief without italics in a normal sentence, like this: 'I've never read The Book Thief' it kind of doesn't stand out enough.

Now for fun let's say The Bible. I don't know, I think it's like what Spark said, The Bible isn't contemporary... and it just looks wrong- I know that's probably just because we've been cultured to view it that way, but I don't know.

I think the thing is we're so used to The Bible that it has become a more noun-y noun ( that's the only way I think I can describe my thoughts xP ).



I'm just guessing though... have you tried googling it? *googles*

As for underlining... I have no idea.
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Fri Feb 27, 2015 1:04 am
Aley says...



@Tenyo and @LadySpark

Apparently my original inquiry wasn't very clear. For MLA style formatting, which has specific rules about grammar, the rule for how to write titles is that if it is a longer work, such as an anthology, a long poem, a play, a book, or a series, then it is italicized or underlined if you're handwriting it. Shorter titles of things are quoted.

With that rule, they also say not to italicize the Bible, but we do italicize things like The Illiad which, according to google, was written in 762 B.C., so no, your argument doesn't stand up and I'm not here to argue. I'm here to ask if someone knows or can postulate why we don't italicize The Bible.

So to be clear, I'm asking why isn't The Bible italicized in essay formats such as we italicize things like The Merchant of Venice. I'm not talking about stress italics or underlines for things like that.

I'm more interested in Why is it that when we wrote up the rules for things like MLA and APA, The Bible and holy books were omitted from rules such as "Titles of long works must be italicized" and we end up with it looking wrong, which means it's ungrammatical [since grammar is a construct of what we find natural to do].

Personally I think that HolySocks is closer to what I want to know. Is it because we're using it more as a noun than a title? Is it a name instead of a title? What do you think? Is there some history buff out there who can tell me what The Bible was considered when that rule was standardized?
  





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Fri Feb 27, 2015 1:16 am
LadySpark says...



lol yeah I thought you were talking about the content, not the title xD

As for the title, I think you've hit the nail on the head when you said 'using it more as a noun than a title'. And also, (and this is just total thinking, I have no idea if this is actually a thing or not,) but maybe we call it "The Bible" instead of The Bible, because "The Bible" has more of an impact when you read it. If you put the two side by side, which one feels more powerful to you? This is quite literally a bible for an entire religion of people to follow, so I'm not sure I'd put it on the same level as a piece of classic literature like the Illiad.

Just thoughts though, I have no idea of the actual reasoning behind that.
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Fri Feb 27, 2015 1:26 am
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Kale says...



I'm wondering what your source is because all of my sources for citing with MLA has you italicize the title of the specific Bible you're citing from.

In APA though, all classical religious books as well as Greek and Roman works are excepted, and the Bible don't even need to be cited by title.

I guess it has to do with how common Bibles are, as well as how many editions are present. A lot of verse citations are just the book, chapter, and verse numbers without accompanying text, so I suppose it's assumed that you have access to a copy and know what the citation is referring to, which is the whole point of citations: to help you find the original source.

I noticed as I was writing this post and talking about Bibles in general, "Bible" acts more like a proper noun than a title, so it makes sense that you don't italicize it. Unless you specify which edition of the Bible you're working with, it's a placeholder for all Bibles everywhere.
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Fri Feb 27, 2015 2:06 am
Aley says...



Maybe you can help me tell if these are credible sources? I saw multiple that said the same thing (not to) when I put it in question form in google.

http://grammar.ccc.commnet.edu/grammar/italics.htm
http://public.wsu.edu/~delahoyd/bible.doc.html
http://grammar.yourdictionary.com/punct ... icize.html
  





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Fri Feb 27, 2015 11:45 am
Snoink says...



Maybe because there's no standardized version of the bible?
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Sat Feb 28, 2015 5:45 am
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Kale says...



I think I see where the confusion is coming from.

When you're talking about or referring to sacred texts in general, the title isn't italicized or put in quotation marks. Works like the Torah, Qur'an, etc. are included. When you're referring to a specific version or edition, however, you do italicize the title.

There's an example in this source you linked of a specific version being cited; in that case, it's The New English Bible.

Additionally, even though there are many versions and editions, the books/chapters generally remain the same (unless you're comparing Catholic vs. Protestant versions), so the titles of the books/chapters within are not formatted, for the same reason the titles of the sacred books aren't.

There's also common convention influencing how things like the Bible are cited. It's so common to see a verse cited like 1 Corinthians 13:4-8 that it's accepted in MLA, even though according to the proper format, there'd be a period instead of a colon.

Anyways, because there's so many different versions of various sacred texts, especially when you factor in the different translations, I always cited the specific version I was using to avoid any ambiguity. It's better to be too specific rather than not specific enough. ;P

Especially since different translations sometimes result in rather dramatic differences in meaning between the same passage. I forget the specific passage, but it's one that's often cited as justification for going out and forcefully converting non-Christians, as that passage essentially says that one of a Christian's duties is to go out and convert nonbelievers. Not all versions of the Bible say that, however, and at least one Catholic Bible translates that passage as it being a Christian's duty to teach nonbelievers, which is a lot less forceful and more respectful.

(Version comparisons are fun.)

Anyways, if you're talking about a sacred text in general, you don't have to italicize the title. If you're talking about or referring to a specific version of a sacred text, then you do have to italicize the title of that specific version.

---

To put it a different way via an analogy, it's kind of like the difference between common nouns and proper nouns: "a countryman" compared to the more specific "a Frenchman". Because proper nouns are specific, they're capitalized to distinguish them from common nouns. Similarly, because sacred texts like the Bible are so common and there are so many versions, you don't format it like you would the title of a more specific work.
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Sat Feb 28, 2015 6:51 pm
Stori says...



What's MLA and APA? And should you italicize the title of the TV series? (I do apologized for playing devil's advocate.)
  





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Sat Feb 28, 2015 8:05 pm
Aley says...



That makes it a lot clearer @Kyllorac!

So how do you tell what version you're looking at? I mean the book I'm using is just titled Genesis [Genesis?]. Would you include who translated it? so like Genesis translated by (Name name)?
  





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Sat Feb 28, 2015 8:35 pm
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Kale says...



For future record, this book was the reason for the question.

And it's cited normally, with italics and everything. Because it's a specific version of Genesis that's standalone.

Mystery solved.
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