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Forbidden love - A romance novel ;)



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Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:05 pm
borntobeawriter says...



Hey everyone,

Okay, well, this is a first for me and I'm rather nervous. *breathes in and out slowly*

I'm finished this for some time and I've been sending it out to publishers. It hasn't caught on. I know it isn't an easy genre; it's a sweet romance written in two parts. What I want to know is whether it hasn't caught on because of its genre; or because it sucks.

The first was from the MC's perspective eight years before, and the second is present day.

Briefly, it's about Chase who's in university and he's been pulled out briefly to become a subsitute teacher in high school. He meets Hayley who needs help in math, a tutor who'll start from scratch with her and he agrees to this, because he feels a connection with her.

That's all I'm saying, but there's nothing sexual about this, which is why it's considered a sweet romance. It's over 65 000 words for you brave souls who are interested.

Thanks to anyone who would like to read and comment. I certainly appreciate any constructive critism.

Tanya :D
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Wed Oct 27, 2010 5:20 pm
Lauren2010 says...



Review time!

Well this was certainly an interesting story! I loved reading it, thanks so much for sharing it! I like the focus on the usually frowned upon teacher-student relationships (even though Chase wasn't exactly a teacher at the start). Hayley's and Chase's characters were both very likeable, and fun to read about. The supporting characters were also intruiging and added a nice flair to the story. Now, on to specifics!

Plot
While you definitely have the basic progression of plot down great, there feels like something is missing. A lot of the story felt a little rushed, especially in part one. Chase and Hayley's relationship advanced really quickly without much of its development being shown to the reader. Since you're dealing with a really controversial relationship, it needs that sort of evidence of progression in order for the reader to sympathise with it and want them to win out in the end, despite the wrongness of the teacher-student relationship. The reader needs to see them with no attraction at first, and then a slow - and natural, believable - build to that relationship. Then, by the time they are grapling with their feelings and the risk of the relationship the reader is a lot more invested and really wants it to work out (instead of being creeped out by this older guy trying to date a high school girl).

So I suggest slowing it down, definitely during the formation of their relationship. Stick to their characters religiously and let them naturally form a relationship. As an example, a girl who I graduated with is dating a guy who is 26 and she's 18. The main reason why this isn't super creepy is because they grew up together, they're neighbors, and their families are close. Their relationship developed over time and it's more natural for it to have come to this point.

Characters
Hayley
I'd really love to see Hayley stick to her character more. She's said to be shy, and quiet, but a lot of the things she does don't reflect what her personality is supposed to be. It's really easy to take our characters out of character for the sake of something happening in a certain way (usually because we, as writers, want it to happen that way xD) but it's so much more natural and appealing for things to happen in a way that works with character's personalities. Sometimes it can be a little different from how we initially planned, but some really awesome results can come out of it.
Also, Hayley is strong and very family-oriented. I love this, and think it is really well reflected when her mom dies. I'd like to see some more of that before her mom dies as well, since it is suggested that this is a way she's always been.
And her writing, there was no hint of this until the middle-end of part one but apparently she had been doing it her whole life? This is something that should be shown from the beginning, if its that important to her.

Also at the end. Woah baby! Hayley seemed like a completely different person! If anyone, it seems like Chase would initiate a scene like that but not shy, quiet Hayley. Unless she's changed drastically in the eight years they were apart.

Chase
I really really really want to like Chase. So badly do I want to like him. But I can't get over how creepy he seems in the first part! He completely goes after a high school student with very little thought against it. He puts his job at stake, his entire career at stake, as well as this young girls reputation. Someone can go to jail for innapropriate relations with a minor, no matter how innocent. Please give him a tad more sense? xD He's a lovely character, and you want readers to fall for him like Hayley does.

I like the added tension of his father having relations with a student, but having so many people at the same school with student-teacherish relations is a little farfetched... Perhaps if it was a different school? I don't know, it could just be me being picky. :P

Hayley's Family
Hayley's family is very easy to split into character architypes. The overprotective brother, the innocent sister, the independent parent-like daughter, the dead mother, the grieving father who can't deal without her. Her family is an important part of the story, and I would love to see them developed a tad more.

Alan
I love Alan. He's one of my favorite characters. I like the irony of his having married a student (though I wish he was a good bit more insistent that Chase should back off until Hayley graduated, he seems like a very sensible man) and how he befriends both Chase and Hayley.

Alright, I think those are all the big things I wanted to say. This story has so much potential that is still yet to be reached (nevermind all the potential it's already reached! :D). The biggest thing I want you to take from my review is to slow it down! Haha. The reader wants to see that progression of their relationship, and it's important to the plot. Just developing their relationship more will do immense good.

As I read, I made notes, comments, and suggestions on the manuscript (all in red). I'll attach the document so you can check it out. But keep in mind, they are all pretty much initial reactions and should be taken with a grain of salt. All the big things, all my final thoughts, are in this review here. Most of my comments in the story are small, and could just be me misunderstanding or not having enough knowledge about things.

You've done so well with this story, and there is so much more good you can do with it. Don't give up, keep editing and editing until you get that shiny letter back from an agent/publisher.

<3 Good luck!

-Lauren-
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Wed Oct 27, 2010 5:22 pm
borntobeawriter says...



Yay! Lauren, thanks! :D
  





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Thu Oct 28, 2010 7:16 pm
Rascalover says...



Place holder for a review :) Since you reviewed mine.

Still workin' on it I promise.

One point i have noticed:
When using a conjunction like and or but... always use a comma before them for you can combine the two complete sentences. Also, when using a semi-colon you are combining two complete sentences, not fragments and complete sentences.
Last edited by Rascalover on Sun Oct 31, 2010 10:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Fri Oct 29, 2010 1:29 am
Lauren2010 says...



Done! I edited my first post with the review. I had to upoad it as a Rich Text Format document, because I couldn't do it any other way. Hope that doesn't cause problems.

I hope my review is helpful! You're a talented writer, Tanya, I wish you the best of luck. :D

-Lauren-
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Fri Oct 29, 2010 2:24 pm
borntobeawriter says...



Lauren - Wow!

Thank you so much for such a thorough review. I knew my story still had....holes. I know that teacher-student relationships are quite controversial, and I didn't want to add too much into the relationship from eight years ago, you know? I'm so glad you gave me such great critism. Thank you.

Rascal, perfect, thank you! I'm awaiting your review impatiently.

Tanya :D
  





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Sun Oct 31, 2010 1:27 pm
Sins says...



I'll save a spot here for a review. I owe you! :)

Edit: I've officially got 52 pages left! I'll hopefully be able to give you my full review by the end of the week at the latest. And I do owe you... In my mind, anyway! xD
Last edited by Sins on Tue Nov 02, 2010 6:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Sun Oct 31, 2010 1:40 pm
borntobeawriter says...



Yay! Thanks Skins! And nonsense;you don't owe me anything. But I'll be glad to hear your thoughts :D
  





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Thu Nov 04, 2010 8:41 pm
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Sins says...



I've put the review in a spoiler 'cause it's kind of long... and it'll make the thread look cramped...

*OCD kicking in*.

Spoiler! :
After a couple of afternoons and evenings reading your novel, I've finally finished reading it! So, my dearie, here I am to review. :)

Brief Overall Impression

My overall impression of this was really great, Tanya. For someone who holds immortality ceremonies on their children, you sure can write well. I might even have started forgetting about your cruel ceremonies. Your grammar and spelling as a whole was great. I did find the odd little error, but they were typo's mostly. Your characters were entertaining - each one of them had their own distinctive personality, and one of my favourite things about this novel was the plot. Like Lauren's said, the whole student teacher relationship thing is a very controversial thing to write about, and I think you handled it exceptionally well. Now for the grittier stuff... ;)


Beginning and Ending

Although your beginning was good, there was something about your ending which I very much liked. I thought that it was a lovely way to close the novel, even if it was a little suggestive... It was cute! Plus, I always do love a happy ending. As for your beginning, it was good, but I'd love to see a bit more oomph in it. I've said something like this in the review on the file attachment, but I'll try and say it a bit clearer here. It's not that your beginning was boring, not by a long shot, but first chapters are insanely important. If your opening chapter doesn't really, and I mean really, pull your readers in, the publishers won't be insanely interested. They're touchy people, aye.

What I'd suggest is that you edit it up a little, and try and create some real mystery in it, something that will make us readers have to look twice, or something that really sets the scene. You're a talented writer, Tanya, and I know you can do it. Starting the chapter off with a really effective line is a great way to start. For example, it begins with a bloke looking around a classroom. I know I've toned it down and left out a load of details, but as a brief summary of the beginning, that's it. Do you see what I mean by saying it could have been exciting. This is just an example, but what you could do is start off with a prologue type thing about Chase's father and Audrey. That would hint at what the book is about overall, and it could be a great way of creating an atmosphere and has great mystery potential. That's just a suggestion though; there are plenty of things you could do.

Plot

Like I've already said, I love the idea of this novel as a whole. It's about a rather taboo subject, and I'm glad you've managed to write about it in an effective way. That takes some skill. I'l start off with the beginning of the novel. As you'll be able to tell by my file attachment review, I felt that the beginning could have done with a bit of a slower pace. It was just that Hayley and Chase fell in love awfully quickly. It was almost as though they decided they were in love after meeting for one day. Obviously, that's an exaggeration, but I hope you get my point. The main problem with them not having their relationship progress slowly is simply that it's harder for us readers to emphasize and sympathise with the couple. We didn't really get to know their relationship. We didn't see Chase's cooking lessons, or many of Hayley's tutoring.

Another little issue that I found this caused was that it put me off Chase a bit, which bothered me because I really wanted to love his character. Don't get me wrong, I liked his character very much, but I wasn't quite loving him. The reason for this was because of his hastiness at the beginning. It almost felt as though he didn't care that Hayley was a student; why not, eh? Because of that, he came across as a little pervish at the beginning, and as I read the rest of the chapters, the thought of his behaviour at the beginning kept on niggling at my mind. All I'm saying is that I'd love for you to not only tell us what Chase and Hayley did when together, but show us! Let us live their moments, not just them. Make it feel as though we are Hayley, or we are Chase.


Characters

Overall, I adored reading about your characters. Normally, I'm not a fan of third person stories because I don't feel like I can connect to the characters as well. With this novel though, you kept me reading until the end with your characters, and not just because I told you I'd give you a review! There were some little issues that I found in some of them though, and I do have some advice for you, so I'll get straight onto it!

Chase

Ah... Chasey, Chasey, Chase... From chapter 6 or so onwards, he's great. I love the little jokes and comments he comes out with. The problem I'm having is about chapter 1-5. That's where I feel he's a bit on the creepy side. Like I said in the plot review, I thought he was overly insensible and ended up edging on a bit pervish. You often had him saying and thinking that Hayley was beautiful, that he loved spending time with her, and that he was risking a few things. What I didn't find often was guilt. You did have some instances of this, but there weren't many clear ones. He didn't seem to be avoiding Hayley after realising his feelings, but wanting to spend as much time with her as possible.

Another reason I think part of Chase's character bugs me a little is because you describe him as a very intelligent, sensible guy, but he's the most careless bloke I've read about when it comes to Hayley and his relationship. I know people are foolish and careless in love, blah blah blah, but I don't want Chase to be! I want his sensible character to shine through when he feels like he's getting close to Hayley. If I'm honest, all of this ties up into one main critique. If you lengthen and be more descriptive about Hayley and Chase's relationship, both of these issues will be solved. He won't seem as creepish, and his behaviour will match the personality you set up for him an awful lot better.

Hayley

I really like Hayley's character; she's clearly very family orientated and I love how much of a caring person she obviously is. She's a strong character, which is always something I look out for in romance novels because a lot of writer's make the mistake of creating their leading female character basically live off the leading male one. You, thankfully, haven't done this. The issue I do have with her though is actually exactly what Lauren said... I can't quite figure out what her personality's supposed to be.

At the beginning, you describe her as shy and quiet, and throughout the novel you do that a bit as well, but I don't think the way her character comes across at the beginning is shy and quiet. At the very beginning of the chapter, she has a lot of long dialogue when she's talking to Chase, who's basically a stranger at the time. If she was so quiet and shy, would she have told Chase so much information about herself? I know you wrote that Chase suspected she was usually a quiet, shy person, but how? What made him suspect this because form what I could tell, she was a fan of talking.

Hayley's Family

Tell us more! Hayley's family have great character potential, but I wish I could feel like I know them more. Now, I do feel like we know Elijah, but as for the others, not so much. In fact, I adored Eli's character, although I wish he'd tried to beat up chase... You'll notice that on my file attachment review... :lol: Hey, I like violence, what can I say? What I'd like to see more of are the other family members, especially Hayley's mum considering she dies. Although you wrote her death very effectively, I didn't feel as emotional as you could have made me feel because I simply didn't feel like I knew her. It's like the Chase and Hayley relationship thing: Because we hadn't been shown much of Hayley's mother by the time she died, I couldn't sympathise, emphasize, or feel greatly emotional towards her when she died.

Chase's Family

Tell us even more! I liked Alice's character and I wish we'd seen her more often. She was obviously a very wise, warm hearted woman and I like characters like that. The problem is that as the story went further, she almost disappeared, and I missed her. What I'd like to mention a bit more though is Chase's dad. I think that this guy could have epic character potential. He cheated on his wife - whom he had a child with - when he was in his forties with a sixteen year old girl, and ruined everything. I would have adored for you to show us that scene when he met up with Chase because I'm very intrigued to find out what his character's like. Is he actually a nice guy who feels painfully guilty for what he did, or is he a cold, hard man?


Other Characters

The good thing about your more minor characters was the fact that they didn't just fade into the background with bland personalities. I really liked Alan's character, and I think you portrayed Caroline's character extremely effectively. She came across exactly the way you wanted, plus her desperate behaviour was extremely entertaining. I would have maybe liked to have seen more of Mike and Gaby at the beginning, but that didn't really bother me too much at all.


Anyway....!

Sorry for getting a bit carried away... I have issues... Like you've already been told, this story has a bucket load of potential, most of it which is already filled. It was a wonderful read and I really adored some aspects of it. Remember, this is just my opinion, but overall I feel that you need to slow the beginning down a bit, let us see Hayley and Chase's relationship really growing, maybe let us get to know the family's a bit better, and this will be even more awesome than it already is!

I'll leave by telling you not to give up! Publishers, agents, and all of those guys are awfully picky and it can be damn hard to get something published, even if it is great. I can tell you this now: I have seen far, far worse things published than this awesome story of yours. If that rubbish can get published, then I know yours can. Just be patient and do not give up, Tanya.

Keep writing, oh great one. ;) *Bows*

xoxo Skins
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Thu Nov 04, 2010 9:44 pm
borntobeawriter says...



Skins! Oh, thank you so much for the great review! I really do appreciate it! I'll even call off my ninja penguin *for now*

Thanks a lot!

Tanya :D
  





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Sat Nov 06, 2010 11:02 pm
Rascalover says...



Okay, how do I say this? I got dragged into doing the school play, and I need to catch up on my school work, so i have to pause on reviewing your novel. I feel so bad. Im so sorry :(

Have an awesome day,
tiffany
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