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Song writting?



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Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:44 pm
Dragon99 says...



Let me explain. I find many of my poems match somewhat of a modern song, and I was wondering how would a song writer write his songs nowadays? Any advice cause I really want my poems to feel like a song. What structure should my poem be written in? Rythmatic? Free style? Advice?
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Tue Nov 26, 2013 4:04 am
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Rosendorn says...



This is off the top of my head for what music has:

A sense of rhythm

Basically, if you set the right words together, they can form some semblance of a rhythmical pattern. To take the lyric running through my head now:

Wonder why why
Wonder why why I oughtta
Let you wreck resurrect
whatever you wanna


I'm not completely sure how you'd read that without rhythm, but you notice how the words all have really clear syllables? You can read it in iambic pentameter and it makes sense.

Now, this is a pop punk song. Other genres will have different rhythms to them. Take a good listen to the lyrics and check out how they're broken up in the songbooks to get an idea how they get written out.

Cohesive sounds

Aka, rhyme, repetition, and alliteration. Because that helps create a sense of rhythm.

You can have internal rhymes (let, wreck, resurrect in one line) and end lines (oughtta/wanna). Both these types of rhymes create a sense of flow. Be very careful not to force these, or else you will get a choppy song.

Repetition has its place but you can't overdo it. It can be a good hook for catching attention and keeping continuity, if only on the rhythm front.

Alliteration is using many of the same words that start with the same letter (Wonder why why, wreck resurrect [sound is important], whatever >> wanna). This is another way you can get internal consistency and make people follow along the line much easier.

Flow

This is really, really critical. Because songs have to flow along and never jerk you out of the poem from a formatting issue. Rhymes have to sound natural. The lines have to be easy to read (and therefore sing). Lines are typically shorter in songs than in traditional poetry, unless you're going operatic. Lines in general have to be consistent, at least in how long they sound. You have to be really analytical of awkward lines, of forced rhymes, of spots that are generally hard to say.

Structure

Songs have:
1- Verses
2- A chorus
3- Often a bridge

A chorus is what repeats within the song, verses are the bulk of the beginning, and a bridge is that weird part in songs that doesn't seem to fit with the rest of the song, potentially spoken instead of sung.

Hopefully this helps? If you want to write songs, you'll have to study songs a lot. Both how they're sung, how they match the music, and how they're written.
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Tue Nov 26, 2013 5:59 am
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AdventurerDaniel says...



The problem isn't doing poems to sound like a song that's the issue of the composer to make a poem they like fit a musical scheme. If you want good examples of this look up how many songs are based upon Shakespeare soliloquys the number is staggering. Now if you want to make your poems read like musical lyrics Rosey Unicorn is right you should study musicians that are also gifted lyricist. Just a few good examples Jack Johnson's style is great for kind of rhythmic poetry with rhyme and heavy emphasis on the verse. The Decemberist and Of Montreal have similarities in being surreal in their writing perfect for non-rhyming work. One that hits in the middle in a great way is Edward Sharpe and The Magnetic Zeros but those are just a few suggestions of bands to study.
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Wed Nov 27, 2013 1:39 am
CowLogic says...



@AdventurerDaniel
One that hits in the middle in a great way is Edward Sharpe and The Magnetic Zeros but those are just a few suggestions of bands to study.

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Wed Nov 27, 2013 1:53 am
CowLogic says...



(And the Decemberists but that's less hipster nowadays.)
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Wed Nov 27, 2013 11:40 pm
Blackwood says...



It depends what type of song we are talking about. With alot of pop music its all about commercialization. Simple and repetitive chord progressions, cliche lyrics that sell to an audience. Most of the time those popular songs you hear all the celebrities singing have lyrics that poetically suck. bland rhymes, cliche topics, really silly stuff, but it sells.
If you want to write a song with a poetic and deeper meaning you are going to have to find inspiration away from the 'top of the charts' as I so may say.
Basic structure goes:
Intro, Verse, Chorus, Verse, Bridge, Chorus, Outro. Something along the lines of that, but its flexible.
If you are wanting something more arty/poetic, then feel free to experiment..
For a song I wouldn't recommend through-composed. You would probably want to return to the main idea at least at the beginning and end and some sort of consolidation in the middle.
Just remember, the less simple you are, the less likely your song will appeal to be 'popular' to today's modern audience who tend to have deteriorated to prefer simple music.

One of the most important aspects no matter what your structure is strong words on strong beats. Lets say you have two quick notes and a long held note.
You wouldn't put a word like the, in, then, a, small words on that long note, you would put your powerful word that is the main word on the sentence on the long note.

This problem is most common for beginners if you write the music first then the lyrics. Also it makes your words when you put them in end up being sort of weird, or not very good (i know from experience). When I write songs with words I tend to write the music and the words at the same time.
I recommend you write the words first then the music.
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Sat Nov 30, 2013 8:06 pm
LadySpark says...



Writing songs is a learned art. It's difficult to write good ones, and it's something that comes with practice. As Rosey said, format, structure and rhythm are very important, but that's not all there is to music. If you can put it to music and sing it, they're technically lyrics. Will that make a good song? Probably not.

Practice practice practice is important. Use the format of
Verse
Chorus
Verse
Bridge
Chorus
Ending

as your platform. The first verse is normally where the idea of the song is presented. The main theme of the song is discussed in the chorus. The next verse will continue what the first verse started, sounding similar but not the same. Following the second verse, there is usually a bridge. The bridge is where the magic happens. The music usually changes, and the narrator has some sort of epiphany that has to do with main theme. Finally, repeat the chorus one more time and wrap it all up with a beautiful ending that finishes off the idea crisply and cleanly. If you do that, the rest will come.
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Sun Dec 01, 2013 3:36 am
Dragon99 says...



XD I just realized I created this forum:D Thanks for all the lovely reply's:D
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Sun Dec 01, 2013 9:34 am
LaughingHyena says...



This is pretty interesting, I've written several random songs before though I've never sung them or anything, using a solid structure to organise the lyrics seems a good idea.
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Mon Dec 02, 2013 12:35 am
Karzkin says...



I guess the main difference between poetry and song is melody. If you play an instrument and know a bit about music try composing a melody, then set words to it (or if you already have the words try to compose a melody to go with them).
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