Young Writers Society

I was curious, its for my NaNo novel so if I don't find it here, maybe I'll ask on their forum.

When did they stop being called surnames, and started being called last names? why? When did these 'surnames' start getting used? Because, they haven't been around for forever. Were surnames different in say....the 1200's than they were in the 1600's, the 1800's? What was the purpose of surnames/last names? Is there any difference between the two?

Okay, a little bit from the OED:

Surname comes from "sirename" or, the name of he who sired you.

1. A name, title, or epithet added to a person's name or names, esp. one derived from his birthplace or from some quality or achievement.
-This useage appeared c1330

2. The name which a person bears in common with the other members of his family, as distinguished from his Christian or given name; a family name.
-Appeared c1375

Both terms feel out of popularity shortly before the turn of the century. In the 21st century, 'surname' is largely associated with Asian/Middle Eastern culture and 'last name' is used more frequently in reference to Western culture.

Really? How odd (last bit); in the UK it's certainly 'surname' more than 'last name'. Of course, the different languages on the continent have different ways off saying it...

I wasn't aware that it wasn't a surname anymore. ^_^ Certainly I've usually heard and usually used sur- rather than 'last'.

In the 1200's you likely would have had (more commonly) surnames for those of good family, nobility (depending, of course, on culture) and names stemming from trade or place for others. Artisans got trade-names that became surnames--Smith, yes? Leonardo Da Vinci is merely "Leonardo from Vinci" in Italian.

You don't happen to have a specific time/era you're considering, do you, Claudette? ^_^

Not particularly, I'm not sure what ero my story is in....

maybe from the 1700's to the mid 1800's.

In America, you parctically never hear 'surname' its always 'last name' so maybe that on its own is regional?

I was mostly curious because I'm debating whether to give my characters last name, and I'm really interested in the use and becoming of the names and such. Because one of my character (if I'm giving last names) will specifically not have a last name, whether for mysterious reasons or because it was rare in her era. (its er...a vampire story. yeah.)

Thanks everyone!!

I dunno... in school, especially elementary or middle, it was last name, but outside of class--and now in college--I've always heard surname. And I've always used surname, too.

Just about all my valuable input on why we have surnames has already been covered... pretty much, they refer to either (a) location, (b) parentage, (c) a noticeable individual trait [this one particularly in Roman times], or (d) vocation. Examples of each: (a) Acton, derived from a town in Middlesex, England; (b) Peterson--pretty self-explanatory, this one; (c) Bliss, from Welsh and English, meaning happy or good-natured; (d) Cooper, one who makes barrels.

I'm no expert but it's my personal opinion that it depends on the era and the person.

For example, a story of mine is set in the middle 1700's in colonial America. I can guerentee not one person used the term "last name" because there were was an abundence of ethnic groups slowly settling in the colonies. A surname would be used to refer a nobility or area of birth in this instance - almost a way of identifing where a person hailed from and their worth in society.

As for people in general, I personally use the term "last name" but if I'm referring to ancestory or a place of birth from a different country, I'll use "surname." For instance my surname is Bruce, and my ancestors hailed from Scotland.

If I made no sense, I apologize. Haven't had coffee yet.

the only real thing I can add is that in Israel, at least, we call it "family name" but even there are many types. Like there are your standard Eastern European sur/lastnames like Greenbaum, Goldberg, Stein, etc. But there are also ones derived from lineage. For example: Ben-Gurion is means "Son of Gurion" Gurion, isn't a real name, tho. He took his Yiddish last name, Gorin, and Hebraized it. But there are people with "Ben-Yaakov" (Son of Jacob) or "Ben-Ami) (Son of my people) etc. There are also like "Aharoni" which, roughly translated is Aaronson. Then there are those with arabic sounding last names, cuz they came from the arab countries. Like Abdul. And Hosseini. One of my freinds names sounds very arab, and he looks arab too. So its funny, if I didn't know he was Jewish, I would have thought he was an arab. Arman Hosseini his name is.

Sorry for the thread-jack.

Sorry for the thread-jack.

Oh I don't think its thread jacking that was pretty interesting! Reminded me of the set up of Spanish last names...

Thanks to all for their input!