Young Writers Society

So, in one of my more recent ideas. One of my main characters will be a male aged sixteen or seventeen. As a female alien, I don't quite know how to approach this point of view so that it will appear as authentic to the readers.

Because I attend an all girls school and am an anti-social crab, I have close to zero contact with guys. So, how can I do that? Because obviously there are a lot of things that males would viw differently as to girls.

Any suggestions?

Thank you all, children.

-S.s

Thanks for your review on my short story,

I had written a short story few weeks ago, where my Main Character was a college going student. It is written from male's perspective. You can read the story to get an idea about the thinking and dialogues, generally written from males perspective.

A House of Lies

Hey. Thought I'd pop by to offer my unhelpful suggestions. ^_^

Okay, so my cousin pretty much asked me the same question a couple of weeks ago, except he's a guy and he wanted to write from a girl's point of view. So I'll tell you what I told him:

It's your first time writing from the point of view of the opposite gender?

Wing it.

One thing you should never forget is that girl or boy, people are people, and not all people tend to think the same way. The moment a child is born, that's when the gender stereotypes come into being. I'm talking generally. When you think about boys, you automatically think about sports, video games and food. That isn't true for all boys. So, first things first -- what's your main character like? I'm talking about flaws here, quirks, likes, dislikes and whatnot.

Your character is a person. Ask him what he wants; if you find it easier to base him of a real-life person, then by all means go for it. Talk to him, and let him control the story. Don't worry about making it seem authentic just yet. Write, re-write and you'll learn. That's all I can say.

On a side note, I could probably be more helpful by suggesting you read stories that are written from a male's perspective.

I found this while messing around online:

– I’ve read stats that women say 20,000 words per day compared to men speaking only 7,000 per day. Just because they’re not talking out loud, doesn’t mean things are silent inside. So, there’s a bit more introspection with male leads. Though, you need to make sure it comes in short bursts, but that’s a whole ‘nother post.

– Men are more sight driven. Yep, what they see sticks in their minds. So, when writing a male POV, you’re going to be seeing a lot more. Come on, though, there are still feelings and thoughts going on, too, but most are stimulated by the sight of something.

The rest of it is here.

Good luck writing! I'd like to see what becomes of this story.^

I too have been wondering the same thing because my novel is looking like it's going to be from a male POV (I had originally intended the character to just be an important character and the main character to be this other girl, but I think the story has shifted over to him).

So I can't really give you any straight-up advice. But I can tell you what I did to kinda warm-up. There are always stereotypes of girl vrs boy in everything. But there are still boys who are more like the girl's stereotype and girls who are more like the boys stereotype. So what I did was I wrought a short story from the viewpoint of a boy who was more like the girl's stereotype in the subject that the story was concerning most. I did take into consideration those little things like being more visually oriented and such, but I kept the main character as a more feminine boy (although it sounds weird when I word it that way). That made it so that the change was smaller and easier. Then I did another short with the same idea, only the main character was a little less feminine, and I tried to incorporate more boy-ish things like not talking as much as you'd expect a girl to. And I just kept on writing these shorts from male viewpoints.
I have yet to get to a place where I feel comfortable writing an entire novel from a male's viewpoint. But I have noticed that taking it little by little in this way has made the transition from female viewpoint to male viewpoint a little more understandable. Because there isn't really a huge difference (or at least I haven't noticed it yet), but focusing on the one area and seeing how that one area is different from a girl's viewpoint has helped me to understand the boy's viewpoint more. And the better you understand something the better you can write it.

So yeah, I haven't gotten to a place where I'm really comfortable writing from a male perspective, so I can't tell you exactly how helpful this is. But so far it has seemed helpful. And in every other area of life that I can think of practice and taking it slow usually ends up with a better understanding of what you're doing. So maybe give this a try?

How to write a male character:

Write them as a person. Seriously, pretty much just what Pompadour said. I heavily endorse reading works from a male perspective, and also recognizing that boys' internal voice has a tendency to be fairly similar to that of a girl. YWS has stories everywhere that are written from a male perspective, if you don't have any books that are, so it might be worth running around and looking for them.

Really though, the most important part is remembering that boys aren't all sports masters with no feelings except "misogynistic jerk" "girl-craaaazyyyy" and "SPORTS MASTERS WHOO WHOO WHOO". They have their own personal moral codes and belief systems and interests and weird personality traits, and there really aren't any personality traits that are strictly male or female. People are all over the place like that.

Step 1: Read a couple male POV stories if it'd make you feel more comfortable
Step 2: Create your character and just go with it

It's not unusual for authors to write from perspectives that are opposite their gender. I actually find myself preferring to write from female perspectives. I think they make more intriguing characters.

My advice for those who want to write characters from an opposite gender? Read. Read whatever you can get your hands on (not just the books written from the perspective from which you want to write). The more you are exposed to various voices in literature, the more easily authentic characters will come to you, no matter the type of character.

Here is a list of some of my favorite books that have influenced my own voice and style as a writer. Pick through it, see if any of them sound interesting, and keep reading!

Gender psychology is a beautiful thing =] So here I am to infodump.

Girls focus more on colour, space and aesthetics. They'll be more aware of smell and vocal tone, and react less to loud or strange noises. Boys focus on shape and practicality, less aware of variances in smells, have more of a reaction to loud or unpleasant sounds. Girls see things on a broader scope where boys are more centralised, and girls will see more of how something can be used where boys will have a better grasp of what makes it work.

Physical descriptions

When a girl describes somebody's clothing she's more likely to talk about how red that cape is, or the faded scuffle marks on those boots. Boys are more likely to talk about the whether the cap flows or hangs, or how chunky the boots are.

On first impressions girls will notice the colouring of someone's skin- whether they're sickly pale or rosy-cheeked, or whether their hair is naturally blonde or sun-bleached or dyed based on the variances in colour.

Boys are more likely to notice the shape of the person- the jaw or cheeks, and they may be more likely to notice how long the hair is, or how puffy or flat it is, but they're much less likely to notice the colour of it.

When a tall figure in dark clothing walks in, a girl will be intimidated by the clothing and the shadow of a hood, where a boy will be more intimidated by the size and definition.

When someone attractive walks in, a girl will notice the skin tone and will be attracted to a healthy glow, where a boy will notice the physique and be attracted by a fit shape.

Space and environment

Girls are more attracted to light. They'll notice lighting effects and colours, shiny or glittering things, and equally they'll be more aware of changes in lighting. Boys are more attracted to finer details, shapes and patterns, and to text.

Generally both genders internally are equally affected by their environment, but interpret it in different ways. Boys will be less aware and tend to divert their emotions, where girls will over react to the surroundings.

So, in a situation of stress a boy might ramble about the girl who is distracting him by constantly moving things around the room. The girl on the other hand would ramble about how the boy's laziness annoys her.

Action and consequence

Boys see specific details where girls see the overall picture. A boy would focus on particular actions that built up to a final consequence, where a girl would see all attributing factors but in less detail.

So, in the event that a fight broke out a boy would talk more about the biggest strikes or punches that decided who the victor was. He'd also remember the face of the person who tried to break them up, but not who was watching in the crowd.

The girl would be more aware of the reactions of the public and the pacing of the fight than the specific details. She'd remember that someone tried to interfere, but not exactly who, and she'd remember the sound of sirens before the police arrived.

Generally...
These are generalisations so not everything applies to everybody- and of course just because one gender is more likely to notice something, doesn't mean the other is oblivious. Usually though, when you look at the differences between male and females when they write or listen to what they recall when telling stories, these are the kinds of patterns they follow.

@Tenyo Ah, thank you so much! That really helped me, because once I get a general view of the psychological mind of males. I can pretty much wing it..sort of anyways.

@Pompadour: That link was awesome! WD never fails as a guide!

And to everyone else, thank you all so much!

Since I'm such a big military sci-fi fan, let me recommend a couple "gender benders" in that genre.

David Weber, author of the Honor Harrington series, is a man who writes from a woman's perspective. Honor is a "heavy-world" human, which means she's physically stronger than some "normal" men.

Lois McMaster Bujold wrote the Vorkosigan Saga novels, most of which are written from a man's point of view. Her main character in this series is Miles Vorkosigan, a brittle-boned fellow who grew up on a planet obsessed with all things military.

I hope these examples are helpful to you. Give me a shout if you'd like to discuss anything to do with the books, or with men's perspective in general.

Thing is, the psychology of males is socially constructed. The human brain is extremely plastic, therefore how a man thinks is determined by:

- Social expectations of masculinity
- Parents' expectations of sons
- Friend group
- Time period (changes all of the above)
- Culturally valued traits for men (some cultures value men who are very nurturing)
- The man's own personality (appears in any context)
- The man's coping mechanisms (can change depending on how men are expected to be vs the personality)

So if you're writing a guy in modern context? Then yes a lot of gender psychology will apply (but still make him his own person— studies only take the average and the most prominent trends and plain old can't represent everyone). But if you're writing a guy in a completely different historical context, build the gender roles from the ground, up, and determine how men and women are supposed to be in that context.

For example, in Viking culture, women were expected to be better at finances (they had the magic to predict the future). A lot of cultures actually wanted women to be better at finances, because they ran the whole household (this includes what princesses in Europe were expected to know!). The idea that women can't do math is very much a modern, Western construct of gender. In some societies, women were expected to be quiet— while in others they were expected to run everything.

One Native American culture (Unfortunately, I forget which. I think it was one of the Pueblo peoples) had men be the artisans and women were the dominant power in society, which included planting crops, running the trade, managing households, producing the necessary goods for day to day life. Men produced the non-necessary goods and were the guardians of religious traditions, and weren't all that involved in what made day to day life run.

Men in a culture like that would think a lot differently than those raised in Western society. Also, this people had different cultural ideals. That would influence how they thought even more.

Another Native American culture I know of (again, forget which!) never elected a leader. However, the US Government required a leader to speak to. They elected a leader by giving reasons why they should not be elected, and the worst reason why they should not lead won. After the leader was elected, the leader did absolutely nothing different and had no special rank; they simply talked to the US Government when required. Total opposite to what we do, but that's what their culture demanded.

Also, archeologists are discovering that some of the most decorated hunters dug up were actually biologically female. We have no idea if these people identified as women, because the idea that there are only men and women with no other genders is actually fairly new (a lot of cultures have three genders, and some have more), but they were biologically female. Apache culture allowed women warriors, and several are named in history: Lozen and Dahteste being some of the most prominent.

Tl;dr: Gender is socially constructed therefore if you try to apply modern gender psychology to anything but society it was taken from in the time period it was written in, the research plain old won't apply.

^ Of course, what Rosey said about culture still applies.

But there are aspects of gender psychology that are the same throughout cultures. I think when they're the same despite opposing cultures, and when they occur even in transgenders (even if the child doesn't know they were originally male.) Having only two genders isn't that new either, and certainly not the prejudice of those who fall outside of them.

To say that gender is completely socially constructed is a more extreme spin of the discussion. I tried to include only the ones that weren't derogatory or culturally definitive, so it's safe to use those if nothing else.

Thing is, sex =/= gender.

Sex is biological, and gender is the roles and expectations around "men" and "women." So yes, there are certain biological realities for those with certain biological parts, but the expectations around them can be really socially constructed! For example, Namibian female husbands. They're completely treated as men and expected to be as men. They take on wives, and it is the wives who have children (via an unattached man).

Be as philosophical you want @Rosey%20Unicorn , but there are few wise rules to follow with writing, even if its not realistic.

One of those is to avoid going to far outside of our understanding of social norms, if you do you just confuse people, even if technically it would be better to make things more "realistic" that does not mean it would be enjoyable to read.

So sticking to stereotypes and gender roles of the country you are in or countries you intend it to be read is in acceptable and in fact encouraged to some extent as it allows a quicker understanding of the person, without covering every tiny detail. After establishing you can add on things and because they see it the same as ours those differences you point out later become more valid to the story and environment.

Where do I say to not apply social norms? My post is explaining that social norms are different across cultures, and to avoid non-relavent social norms.

From my first post on this thread:

So if you're writing a guy in modern context? Then yes a lot of gender psychology will apply (but still make him his own person— studies only take the average and the most prominent trends and plain old can't represent everyone).

I say "a lot" because, well, not everybody fits social norms. Gender psychology is a start point, not an end point.

Thing is, these threads tend to become resources for other people later on, and those people might not be writing from a modern, western context. They could be writing from a fantasy context, or from a non-western context. In which case, all the "men do x women do y" no longer applies. The original post didn't specify location and time period, after all, so it could be a fantasy context for all we know.

It is completely and totally realistic to be aware of social norms and apply to them. However, social norms are not universal, and I think it's really important for writers to know that. So when they go to write a non-modern, and/or non-western society, they don't apply their own norms to a culture where those norms do not apply in.

This is not "being philosophical"— this is explaining how different cultures have different norms, so you must be aware of all those norms if you're going to write in those cultures.

Reminds me of a Japanese game, The Legend of Dragoon. In it the main character tried to protect his female friend, while she wanted to fight alongside him.