Young Writers Society

Home » Forums » Community » Serious Discussion and Debate

God vs.Science

Post a reply
Random avatar

Gender: None specified
Points: 650
Reviews: 0
Thu Feb 02, 2012 11:19 am
View Likes
Jubilee711 says...



Once upon a time, there was a shrewd scientist named Alan Smith..Hw has a dream; he had a vision.He had no family.He had disassociated from his friends. He had no foe either. He was on His own in d middle of a very small and uninhabited Island but yet, he had a dream; he had a vision.
He worked tirelessly day and night like a bird building her nest. He suffered. He suffered but yet His dream and his vision kept him going..
After many years of labour, he was able to make the Island d paradise he had in his mind. He had drawn a master plan of how He wanted the Island to be. Beatiful trees , rechanneled waterfalls, tamed wild animals strolling around freely.... That was his dream_to make the Island a paradise and had achieved it. He was happy but not satisfied.He still had a goal not yet achieved. He still had a vision..
He did not rest but started immediately on his vision. Again, he worked and suffered but he persevered.. "T'll soon be over", he always said to himself.
After many years of tireless labour, he was able 2 transform his vision to reality..He create an organism that looked like him..The creation had in him almost all d organs that can b found in man, but they were artificial and would not last long. Alan Smit
h was to replace his oxygen tube every 24 hours but he did not care. His vision was standing before him, solid.. Though it could think, its thoughts were only limited to the code which were installed in its 'brain'. Nevertheless, Alan was satisfied. His goal was finally achieved.He called his creation Finn Smith for automatically
, it became his son..
Finn Smith controlled his 'father's' Island and whenever Alan looked at him, he felt that he had no more worries. Unfortunately, he had for Finn grew more intelligent as each day passed. Finn's coded installments were almost infinite.

One sad day, Finn wandered away from the Island in search of independence and freedom. Alan searched for him but could not find him and became grieved not just because he had lost Finn but because he knew that Finn will wander into a world entirely different to him and would have to survive by developing new negative survival habits that would be indeed, very dangerous. Afterall, he was almost as intelligent as an average human being..
This did happen and infact, Finn turned from a lovely, intelligent creature, to a wild and uncontrollable tormented beast..Finn was doomed forever..
This story can be related to the creation story in d Bible. God's first goal was to create a paradise devoid of imperfection . He did create this paradise and all that was in it but that was nt his vision. He was lonely, without anyone like him. He wandered around in the universe without a friend or foe. He had no begin and no ending. No mother or father. He was alone. He was Elohim_God d self existing one.(Gen 1). He could only be God if He was worshiped and so, He created d Angels among who was Lucifer or Satan..
Yet, God was satisfied. After creating the heavens and earth and animals and plants and angels, He still lacked somthing and was fellowship; companionship. This made Him to create man in His own image. The first man_Adam, was an amature god..He had fellowship with God, and was Gods only companion. He was the Lord of the earth and God was proud of him. Like my fictitious Alan, God looked at Adam and saw perfection in its fullness. Indeed, He had a son..
Meanwhile, Lucifer who was the closest angel to God rebelled against God and was thrown down from heaven. He came down on earth with d sole purpose of turning God's greatest creation against God.
God gave Adam a help mate whom we all know as Eve. She was a weaker creation as she was created from Adam. Lucifer knew he could not get to Adam directly and so he has to deceive Eve the weaker vessel and through her, He was able to get to Adam..(Gen 2).
Eve did not just eat an Apple. She was involved in the one act between two people that was carried out naked.Sex!!.. Adam and Eve did not know that they were naked or even wht nakedness meant prior to the time they were deceived because they had nothing to cover.But after they were deceived into having sex, d realised they had to cover something..
The only other creature that was in a way, like God, apart from Adam was Lucifer. He was infact God's right hand man in heaven before he rebelled and was thrown down. He wanted to be, like God , a god; to be worshiped and to rule the earth. The only way of doing that was by making man fall. He knew that if he succeeded in making man to fall he would no longer be under man but will be his lord. Yet, the choice was Adam's to make and he knew that Adam would never compromise.. He poccessed the other creature that was like man_the serpent..
Gensis 3_"now the serpent was more subtle(wise, cunning) than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made". The serpent was subtle. It was wise and almost as wise as man. It had a brain almost as active as that of a man. It could even talk for it said to the woman in the first verse of Genesis 3 _" Has God indeed said 'You shall not eat of every tree of the garden'?" Ofcourse, it was not the serpent speaking but Lucifer which was in it. We must note also that the serpent was a friend to Adam & Eve and ordinarily would not have the guts to try to make them go against God's will. Yet, Lucifer exploited its friendship and closeness to Adam and Eve and though it, was able to deceive Eve into committing adultery with the serpent.. When Adam came home, Eve also introduced the act of sex to him and this made them know that they were naked..
Meanwhile, after having sex with both the serpent(who was being controlled by Lucifer) and Adam, she conceived. She had two seeds in her. One was Cain d seed of Lucifer and Abel the seed of Adam.
When God came down to fellowship with His children like He always did, He found out that they were hiding from Him.They had failed Him. They had sinned against Him. He gave man the power of choice; to choose between good and evil and they had choosen evil. He cursed the pregnant Eve with painful childbirth and cursed Adam with hardship. Most importantly, He erased the link between the beasts of the field and man.(Gen 3:9-24).This is why it will never be possible for Scientists to prove that man is connected to a Monkey or an Ape. The connection was lost when the serpent was made to start crawling on its belly.. It was completely changed. Finally, they were removed from the land of perfection_Eden.
Eve gave birth to good and evil-Cain(seed of Lucifer) and Abel (seed of Adam). Cain was an embodiment of everything Lucifer was.He was evil and therefore God hated Him and could not accept his sacrifice. God loved Abel and accepted his sacrifice.. We all know what happened. Cain killed Abel out of jealousy.
Adam had another seed with Eve and His name was Seth..Adams seed were the sons of God since Adam was a son of God..
As both the seed of Seth(the sons of God) and the seed of Cain(the sons of men began to multiply, the men from the linage of Seth married the women from Cain's tribe because they were really beautiful.. Now the earth was contaminated..
God still had a plan. Men could not be controlled as a group but as individuals. God wanted individuals who would choose to serve Him from their heart. The first of such individuals was Enoch, them Noah and Abraham.. Men could not be controlled in group. Even the children of Israel proved that by constantly sinning against God. Also, choosing the good over the evil, God over Lucifer was not something to be inherited.
You might ask: "Why didn't God destroy Lucifer, Adam, Eve..etc, when they turned against Him?" The answer is that God is Ominipotent. He knows the end from the beginning. The fact is that they were only unconsciously playing there parts in God's great drama.. If man did not fall, God wouldn't have had the cause to heal because Adam could not fall sick.. He wouldn't have been a forgiving God because Adam would have never sinned.
He wouldn't have had any cause to provide because everything Adam needed was already provided for prior to his creation.. All these were God's Attributes and we would have never known of them if not for the fall of man which the devil himself played a part in.
Down through the ages, God showed His attributes to different people at different times but they were mainly shown to the children of Israel
God did not want to be a biased God
He wanted to show His most important attribute _love.. So that whoever choose to serve Him will serve Him out of love n not out of fear of punishment. That is the difference between fellowship and religion. Fellowship was pivoted by love_ the love of God and of one another, Religion makes one to serve God with fear of punishment and of Hell fire.. Hell fire exists but not for the purpose of forcing one to choose to serve God. This is what Religion tries to do.
So Jesus died and rose on the third day to prove that
He is God, the only entity that had the power of life and death..
A few years after Jesus' death Christians had fellowship with one another and with God and God vindicated them with signs and wonders.. Nevertheless, the religious bodies killed most of the disciples and followers of Jesus..
Since then religion has always fought against fellowship; fallacy against truth; Lucifer against God.. These war has continue to rage till religion has taken over Christianity, over fellowship; Hatred over love. But somewhere in this world fellowship still exists but in the mind of individuals who have choosen God over darkness.. U can be part of these people by repenting and giving your life to Christ.. These may sound popular to you but repentance this time around will mean real repentance.. My Email address is Jubileeeze@yahoo.com .
Meanwhile, Science will always fight against God just just as religion will always do.. There theory will always be a direct opposite of what God says.. Just repent totally and you will be in the care of the greatest scientist ever_ God..




User avatar
36 Reviews


Gender: Other
Points: 108
Reviews: 36
Thu Feb 02, 2012 5:01 pm
Lapis says...



HaydenSmith wrote:Draknghar, please keep that sort of opinion to yourself.

In a multiverse, one deity as weak as the Christian God cannot truly control all.


I take offense to this. Adonai, Yeshua, Elohim, Yahweh--whatever name you like--is, according to Scripture, all-powerful. I have no idea what you mean by Him being weak.



Ah, please accept my apologies for offending you, for, I must admit, I might have read a little too much of Lovecraft for that night. Anyway, I am still not convinced that if God exists, he is not just part of a created universe. Maybe He was created along with the universe? Anyway, humans know very little, so I will not consider claims made by scriptures or even by myself seriously. Prithee, peace! I just stated my personal opinion.

Edit: But as I think on the actual scale of all the worlds combined... It is more infinite than scientist covey it to be. Please, a qantum computer the size of our universe would be overpowered, or so I come to believe.
"Yeah, I am the brain, some say insane."

"Look for the missing link between your dreams and reality. Find it - it is the key."

-Used to be Letiki :3




User avatar


Gender: None specified
Points: 791
Reviews: 3
Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:34 pm
View Likes
NicholasStone says...



Jubilee, where in the world did you get that information!? I've read Genesis numerous times, and I don't recall anything like what you described.
He stumbled slightly, the limp in his leg still there. He dared not to look at the place he used to call home. He could feel the heat from the fire, the fire that he himself had ignited. He blinked back tears, as he limped away.




User avatar
51 Reviews


Gender: Male
Points: 5513
Reviews: 51
Sat Feb 11, 2012 8:25 pm
View Likes
Cole says...



I agree, Nicholas. Jubilee, I even took a college course totally about the book of Genesis. Most of what you described isn't in Genesis, really.

And science and God are not opposites, by the way. I'm one of the biggest Jesus freaks I know, and one of my favorite subjects is biology and evolution.
My heart holds all secrets; my heart tells no lies.

~Hosea 6:3~
ונדעה נרדפה לדעת את יהוה כשחר נכון מצאו ויבוא כגשם לנו כמלקוש יורה ארץ׃




User avatar
110 Reviews


Gender: Male
Points: 3012
Reviews: 110
Mon Feb 20, 2012 12:04 pm
View Likes
PiesAreSquared says...



Here are some of my suggested reads on the subject of God vs. Science, (In favour of God being included in science): The Bible, Protestantism, and the Rise of Natural Science (Cambridge 1998), and The Fall of Man and the Foundations of Science, both by Peter Harrison, What’s So Great About Christianity? by Dinesh D’Souza, For The Glory of God: How Monotheism Led to Reformations, Science, Witch-hunts and the End of Slavery by Rodney Stark, and there’s a lot of other books worth reading on this subject.
The moment you say that one set of moral ideas can be better than another, you are, in fact, measuring them both by a standard, saying that one of them conforms to that standard more nearly than the other. C. S. Lewis

I used to be ZLYF




User avatar
32 Reviews


Gender: Male
Points: 376
Reviews: 32
Tue Feb 28, 2012 10:34 am
View Likes
TheRobster1991 says...



Pfft, there's way to many of 'these' kind of arguments on here :/
Can't we all just get along?




User avatar
14 Reviews


Gender: None specified
Points: 1062
Reviews: 14
Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:14 am
SkyeDragon says...



Well if you don't like 'these' kind of arguments, start a different one yourself.
I however think 'these' kinds of arguments are, and will be useful for later on in life when you stumble across this topic.
Every great writer was once an amateur.




User avatar
32 Reviews


Gender: Male
Points: 376
Reviews: 32
Tue Mar 20, 2012 3:39 pm
View Likes
TheRobster1991 says...



Well if you don't like 'these' kind of arguments, start a different one yourself.
I however think 'these' kinds of arguments are, and will be useful for later on in life when you stumble across this topic

If I feel the need to, I will. However, there's already a thousand (I exaggerate I know) topics on, Does God exist?, Is there life after death?, Science Vs God, Creation Vs Evolution, etc...

We don't need any more
Can't we all just get along?




User avatar
14 Reviews


Gender: Male
Points: 1017
Reviews: 14
Fri Mar 23, 2012 4:28 am
SirTobes says...



'We' enjoy them. Obviously YWS isn't for you if you don't want 'these' arguments. Everyone is entitled to what they believe.

God didn't make humans.
Humans made God.
There is no evidence he exists, and he is just an excuse because we don't know how humans started. God is just a story. He doesn't exist.
There is no such thing as a stranger. Only friends we haven't met yet.

Previously Just Toby





User avatar
3670 Reviews


Gender: Female
Points: 2141
Reviews: 3670
Fri Mar 23, 2012 6:04 am
View Likes
Snoink says...



Humans don't exist, lol. It's a matter of perception. ;)

In any case, it probably doesn't matter anyway.
Ubi caritas est vera, Deus ibi est.

"The mark of your ignorance is the depth of your belief in injustice and tragedy. What the caterpillar calls the end of the world, the Master calls the butterfly." ~ Richard Bach

Moth and Myth <- My comic! :D




User avatar
32 Reviews


Gender: Male
Points: 376
Reviews: 32
Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:33 am
View Likes
TheRobster1991 says...



'We' enjoy them. Obviously YWS isn't for you if you don't want 'these' arguments. Everyone is entitled to what they believe


Without trying to sound rude. Young Writers Society is for me because:

a) I am Young

b) I enjoy writing

Yes, everyone is entitled to what they believe. But these arguements are always going on. And there are more things to discuss than religion.
God didn't make humans.
Humans made God.
There is no evidence he exists, and he is just an excuse because we don't know how humans started. God is just a story. He doesn't exist

I've had too many atheists that tell me this. If there is no God, why don't you prove it? (This wasn't an invitation to an agurment by the way, but rather an answer to your post) People who don't believe in God sometimes have far more religious zeal than believers

How old are you JustToby anyway? You sound from your other replies as if you are quite young
Can't we all just get along?




User avatar
3670 Reviews


Gender: Female
Points: 2141
Reviews: 3670
Fri Mar 23, 2012 4:25 pm
View Likes
Snoink says...



Before you continue arguing about whether or not people should post on this thread or not, just remember that you are 1) off-topic and 2) posting on this thread. ;)

In any case! Let me just put on my official YWS representative hat...

The Young Writers Society was set up to promote the pastime of young writers in allowing them a space for them to write and discuss things freely with each other in a non-intimidating space. We try to uphold free speech as much as possible (with several legal limitations, like no discussing terrorism, no soliciting minors, etc.).

In any case, if that means that you guys want to discuss religion in five million topics in the debate forum, it is totally okay, just so long as you do so in a way that follows YWS rules. We're not going to shut down threads just because of the subject matter (unless we think it violates the safety of our members). Free speech is good!
Ubi caritas est vera, Deus ibi est.

"The mark of your ignorance is the depth of your belief in injustice and tragedy. What the caterpillar calls the end of the world, the Master calls the butterfly." ~ Richard Bach

Moth and Myth <- My comic! :D




User avatar
110 Reviews


Gender: Male
Points: 3012
Reviews: 110
Sat Mar 24, 2012 10:45 am
PiesAreSquared says...



Now I thought this thread was dead!
God didn't make humans.

Personal opinion. You were not there when humans first appeared, so you can’t make such speculative assertions that you are unable to provide proof.
Humans made God.

Hmmm....interesting. I suppose you’re talking about the hypothetical “god spot”? There is no proof of this. Once again, you are making speculative assertions.
There is no evidence he exists, and he is just an excuse because we don't know how humans started.

We don’t know how humans started but God must definitely not be a cause. Right? Wrong. This is an a priori rejection of the God as the first cause. Just because you see no evidence of his existence does not mean that there is indeed no evidence of his existence. Even if there were no evidence of his existence, that would not disprove his existence, even though it would greatly undermine the FACT of his existence.
This is the evidence from causation, but one of the many evidences of God:
The First Cause of limitless space must be infinite in extent.
The First Cause of endless time must be eternal in duration.
The First Cause of perpetual motion must be omnipotent in power.
The First Cause of unbounded variety must be omnipresent in phenomena.
The First Cause of infinite complexity must be omniscient in intelligence.
The First Cause of consciousness must be personal.
The First Cause of feeling must be emotional.
The First Cause of will must be volitional.
The First Cause of ethical values must be moral.
The First Cause of religious values must be spiritual.
The First Cause of beauty values must be aesthetic.
The First Cause of righteousness must be holy.
The First Cause of justice must be just.
The First Cause of love must be loving.
The First Cause of life must be living.

Add them up and you get the description of the God of the Bible.
God is just a story.

Technically, He’s a spiritual entity, not a story.
He doesn't exist.

I have sufficiently addressed this.
The moment you say that one set of moral ideas can be better than another, you are, in fact, measuring them both by a standard, saying that one of them conforms to that standard more nearly than the other. C. S. Lewis

I used to be ZLYF




User avatar
14 Reviews


Gender: Male
Points: 1017
Reviews: 14
Sat Mar 24, 2012 3:31 pm
SirTobes says...



RobsterJames: Only someone younger then me would ask me that. If you think there are too many threads about religion, ignore them! The world revolves around the sun. If you were old and mature and had been on this site long enough you would know to do that. You can not judge someone based on the posts you see on the Internet. Therefore, I ask kindly, how old are you?

I rest my case.
There is no such thing as a stranger. Only friends we haven't met yet.

Previously Just Toby





User avatar
51 Reviews


Gender: Male
Points: 5513
Reviews: 51
Sat Mar 24, 2012 3:42 pm
View Likes
Cole says...



Hey, let's be nice, okay guys?
My heart holds all secrets; my heart tells no lies.

~Hosea 6:3~
ונדעה נרדפה לדעת את יהוה כשחר נכון מצאו ויבוא כגשם לנו כמלקוש יורה ארץ׃