Young Writers Society

Okay, so there was this one time that I saw this work on YWS and it was SOOOO BAD. Like, literally, all my neurons were firing at the sight and I was afraid that I would go into shock. COULD IT GET THIS MUCH WORSE???

Oh man, I was ready to flame that story alive, and by flame, I don't mean verbally abuse the writer or anything, but nitpick the entire story, rant about how unacceptable the grammar was, how boring the story was, and how it could never ever EVER possibly be published unless, of course, the publisher was a pack of howler monkeys who would simply see the work and print it on banana leaves. It was simply not publishable in any way, shape, or form and if *I* had written it, I would be ashamed to even show it off, let alone get critiques for it. Annoyed, I looked at the age.

The writer was eleven.

Oops.

And yes, I've seen works such as those by writers who were twelve, thirteen... even someone who was seven. And yes, the works were bad, but usually a look at the age would send me into flashback time...

Speaking of which! Now it's time for flashback time! I remember when I was eleven, I was composing such lovely works such as this one. Don't you just love the dialogue? Or perhaps you want an example of short stories, since I do better fiction than plays. Here's such an example!And we can't forget poetry! Just look at this startling poem to get an idea of that.

If, at that developmental time, an older writer told me that I sucked and couldn't write, I wouldn't have even tried progressing in it in any form of writing. IN FACT, what made me write was this story. Oh yes, I know it's complete and utter crap. But my dad said it was good, and that made me feel proud, as if I could do something special -- nay, I was special. It was a great feeling.

Now flash forward two years forward of me being eleven (or six years back from present, if you want to get technical). I was thirteen and I was sure that I was going to be a professional writer. Nay, not only a professional writer but the best writer ever... and I would be published and be the youngest writer ever! And, of course, my novels would be accepted without thought by an adoring public, etc., etc.

What exactly was I writing? Hahaha...

Well, if you're interested in poems, here's one I did.

If you're interested in stories, I have a bunch for you! Here's one that typically summarizes what stuff I wrote and what level it was at. Lovely, isn't it? The plot... the characters... so charming. Oh yeah, I was able to do a couple of good stuff, such as this story, but that was only because I actually edited it based on a simple observation of my sister. She noticed that the middle wasn't up to par to the rest of the stuff, and with a helpful critique, I edited it better.

And YES. I thought I was hot stuff. I was an awesome writer, yada yada. Nobody told me I sucked -- on the contrary, they told me that I was good and gave me some helpful pointers. Or asked questions about my story that made me think.

So yes. I stunk. But I'm better now, due to some helpful criticism.

Please, please, PLEASE, when you give critiques, especially to younger writers, to make it as helpful as you can. No, you don't have to be soppily nice, really. In fact, my best critique of FREAK was when my mom read my first version for FREAK (the thirteen-year-old edition) and instead of saying, "This is the worst thing I ever read" like she was probably thinking, she asked, "Why doesn't the freak commit suicide?" Which was a question that made me think.

Be helpful in your critiques!

very nice rant . i agree.

Personally I prefer treat all ages the same. At 11 I wasn't stupid (what happened in then interveneing 10 years? ><) and I'd've bene pretty mad if I discovered people were toning stuff down because I was a 'child'. If a younger writer is serious, I'll give them the crits they deserve, which will be harsh and nit-picky, and I will tell them to learn grammar and punctuation NOW before they get into bad habits. But I'll also tell them they have potential etc etc and I've read worse--if it's true. But then I'll also say that to older writers. I've seen some 17 year olds who need to get their act together and learn their craft. I've seen 35 year olds who I'm 90% certain will never be published, and 15 year olds who I'm convinced will be one day. And I treat them all the same, because it's not fair to discrimate by age like that. It's not only youngsters who can be discouraged from writing by nasty comments!

Don't tune it down too much and be patronizing - everyone's gotta learn to take critiscm. But *always* say what was good about the piece.

Great tips, Snoink! ^_^

I agree about age for the most part, but, like Imelda brought up, there are always exceptions (young writers who are serious and older writers who can't take a crit). I think the best way to decide how harsh to be is to look at the maturity of the writer. Obviously, if a writer can't piece a decent sentence together and can't take a harsh critique, I'm not going to go line-by-line and tell them how terrible they are at every sentence; more general comments are better for those. Whereas, if a writer has a good grip on the language and has shown maturity, I'll go into the nuances of their style and perhaps even go line-by-line. It's a matter of good judgment.

Yeah, constructive criticism is always the best choice. It's best to not be too harsh and to point out the bad and the good and maturity has to be considered to some degree.

I got a rather harsh but very necessary, constructive criticism when I was younger but I was an insecure, gullible child and when she told me my work was never going to be good enough, I believed her. I very nearly gave up writing. Since then I have matured and thanked my saviour profusely for pointing out the lack of dialogue and interaction between my characters but I still think other people's work should be treated with a certain amount of caution.

That's kind of why I like her point about "being helpful"- because honestly- personally, I can take critiques. And I'm 13, right? Tell me I suck, and I'll try harder to please you.

But at eleven? I would have killed myself. There's always a point where a critique is just nasty and shouldn't be posted- unless you're Brad, and can make the writer laugh before they go dive off a bridge.

Every writer has their own 'maturity point', where they magically stop writing childishly and start getting exponentially better (I know for me that was NaNo '05). But before hand, your job is to get them interested in their craft so that they want to continue and get better. Once they realize what being a writer is all about, bring on the nasty.

So, yeah. Give the same tips that you would any writer, but don't go on a rampage. The words "horrible", "terrible" and so on should never be used.

Use common sense. Is this a mature writer, or someone who's still figuring it all out?

I try to be polite, no matter whose work I'm reviewing. I try not to use the kid gloves, because when I was little, I hated when people would use them with me. I admit, though, if a writer is younger, I'll read their authors notes/other posts to see how mature they sound. Someone like Sam will get a different review than someone who seems less mature. Sometimes you can even tell by their writing style if they can take a "real" review or not. (I haven't seen a lot of those on YWS, though, but there are scads of them on places like Gaia Online.)

I actually have copies of my old stories printed out and nearby. I read them over every now and then, because it's an ego boost and it keeps me grounded at the same time.

If I can tell the person's new to the form (in my mind, age is generally irrelevant) then I simply try to keep any bad habits from forming. Also, I'll tag on a little comforting note saying how I'm only being harsh because I know they have potential, yada yada. If at 13, some 20 year old told me I couldn't write, I'd probably just say 'Yes, but I now have 7 years to become better then you'. I was a cheeky kid. (still am)

I sucked when I was 11. I mean, I had great ideas and I was funny, but oh my GAWD - I was awful all the same!

Everyone told me I was good. They believed it. But I now know, I was HORRIBLE. I can't stand to go back and read the stuff. Ick.

I'm thirteen. I suck. I actually found something I wrote when I was five -YES, FIVE!- on the computer.

I cried.

And that's when I was eleven.

And recently I saw my NaNoPo for that...and cried again.

I wonder if my brain's been taken over by aliens since I was eleven.

I had ideas, I had humor, but I was SO lacking in personality or realistic scenes. (Character1: "Would you like a magical muffin that will take you back to your world?" Crctr2: "Why, yes, thank you, sir! :eats muffin:")

EDIT: In agreement with cadmium here- if I see total crap on the board, I usually don't crit unless A) I can see the story has potential and B) the writer has potential. Both. Otherwise, I can't be bothered.

If I see someone younger writing total crap, I usually just don't crit it, just to be on the safe side.

Younger writers just have to find the right audience, I guess. As Snoink said, a cruel review at a young age could discourage someone from writing.

When I was eleven, I submitted a story to this Scholastic contest and they wrote me and said, "Yeah, we liked your story, we're going to publish you in this anthology with about twenty-six other elementary and middle school kids around the country and then sell the book nationally." My story was horrible to the fifteenth power, but at the time, it was the coolest thing that had ever happened to me. I mean...MY crap was being published and sold in school book catalogs and stores around the country. So not bad. At the time, though, even I had realized that my story wasn't that good. A year after the book came out, I refused to show it to anyone because I was so ashamed of my bad writing. At that time, I would have liked for someone to give me a critique. When a writer can realize that his or her work is imperfect, he or she is probably ready for a little constructive criticism.

It hurts, doesn't it? The crits and comments, I mean. Ouchie. (I'm thirteen, by the way. But shshs...)

And they are supposed to.

Well, maybe not, but close to that. They are supposed to help you become a better writer, and by shredding your story into pieces and correcting mistakes of the above mentioned, that is what the critter is doing. Or trying to do. Or should.

... And me a few years back? *Runs away with a blush* Bad, bad.

Then again, there are not many years that can be catagorized like that, though. But recently, in the basement, I found a book written by the seven-year-old me. About 100 words, and teh coolest thing I ever did, It had illustrations hand-drawn by me.

It was called "Anne and the Tooth Fairy", and was the only book that I finished. Infinitely cool, yes?

But it is horrible, the reaidng through stuff that I wrote when I was younger. *Blushed again*. Probably will be so in a few years, when I'll look back at what I'm writing now...

But I love to read my past work! Diaries, stories, poems. I ransacked my room a year or two back and gathered everything into an anthology and I love o flick back through the pages. A lot of it is really bad yes but it's nice to see that the potential was there even then and some of the work is just hilarious and so cute. I love the memories the pieces back and to see how imaginative a young persons mind is, not restrained by the knowledge I have since gained. Seriously, you can't just forget your past work; all of it's important, mistakes included.

I don't criticise much, but when i do, i can't read a story that doesn't flow. I can't get into a story and sit down and concentrate on it, i mean, i can read it, but i can't READ it. You know, i can't get inside of the story.

Which is generally why i don't criticise too much, because its hard to find a story that i can get into on here.

However, that being said, and reading this thread, i think i will be reading alot more of younger people's stories I remember writing when i was around 7 and i wrote around 8 pages of a story that by the end of it, i had no idea what was happening, who the characters were and i or my teacher couldn't read it