Topic ID: 19592
|
View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Kel
Senior Writer
Gender: 
Age: 26
Joined: 20 Oct 2006
Posts: 181
Reviews: 46
300 Points
|
 Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 1:47 am Post subject: Egg on Your Face |
 |
|
|
_________________
Write from the heart and nothing can go wrong. It's when you write from the wallet that the feeling goes away.
Last edited by Kel on Wed Sep 12, 2007 2:04 am; edited 2 times in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
Squall
A scattered memory that's like a distant dream
Speaker of the Forum
Gender: 
Age: 17
Joined: 01 Feb 2007
Posts: 587
Reviews: 402
Country: New Zealand
450 Points
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 3:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
I love this! This piece flowed very well and you used the right words that brought out the full potential of a scene or the descriptions of the characters. I especially liked the church scene. It was very well done 
This prologue rocked! It kept the storyline of the story a secret and at the same time, it allowed the reader to predict that conflicts will follow prior to Jim's mother's death. I'm most interested to see what conflicts will Jim have to face. Considering he seems like a girly guy, the way that he interacts with the storyline would be most unique and unexpected.
Overall, well done Kel Will continue to read. |
_________________
Dolphins for the win!
Originally known as Clockwerk Goblin. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Alainna
I am a mountain, I am the sea
Master of the Forum
Gender:
Age: 15
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 1713
Reviews: 405
Country: England
453 Points
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:58 am Post subject: |
|
|
I have to agree with Squallz, I'm hooked on this just from the prolouge!
It was very nicely written and the church scene was great.
I'd like to know more about how old Jim is. It's hard to tell by the dialouge that is given. You say junior high but us English have no idea what age that is...so a little expansion would be great.
I'm intrigued as to what killed Alice and why she doesn't want anyone to know. Why would anyone want to hurt Jim and Aaron?
I can't wait for you to post more,
Keep it up,
Alainna
xx
P.S. Sorry for such a lame crit but I could find nothing wrong with the piece! |
_________________
Sanity is for the unimaginative.
Got YWS?
Need a critique, fellow YWS-ers? |
|
| Back to top |
|
TL G-Wooster
magic is fun! we're dead
Epic Novelist
Gender:
Age: 16
Joined: 07 Feb 2007
Posts: 3607
Reviews: 818
Country: in Bavaria where the sheep seldom wear spectacles
427 Points
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 7:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Good! Very good, in fact. At present, the tone is pretty detatched, what with it being in first person and all, so maybe you could add a touch more emotion? Say what Jimmy is thinking, how his thoughts are working, that kind of thing.
| Quote: |
| Jim thought it looked like one of his cartoons- the way it raised up and down as if *it was an accordion. |
I'm not sure what should be here, but I've put a dash in. Check it.
*Forgotten words here.
| Quote: |
| Instead of music, it hissed and gave a hollow choking sound. |
Comma after music?
[quote]Lifting his pale blue eyes, Jim looked past his mother and on to the window.[quote]
Comma after eyes.
--
That aside, I don't think I saw anything nitpicky. 
It was very well written, and the hints of danger to come ARE intriguing. ^_^ I get that Jimmy doesn't know that his mother was going to die in the first bit, so maybe you should add in a bit more of his thoughts in the second bit. Confusion? Sadness? Just now, it's a little flat. Emotionless. He breaks down afterwards, yes, but describe his thoughts during the flower strewing bit.
Just a thought; this was very well writ, and I hope the rest of this goes well, even though I won't be able to crit it. |
_________________
Most people run screaming to the therapist when they hear voices. I write. –Laurie Halse Anderson |
|
| Back to top |
|
Sam
axis of evil, BRB
Epic Novelist
Gender:
Age: 15
Joined: 12 Dec 2004
Posts: 4909
Reviews: 1251
Country: 'mreeka
326 Points
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 8:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Hey, Kel!
*squees* A new novel! I'm excited- this is already promising to be a lot different from everything else on the board, so I'm happy to find something new to get into. ^_^ Don't think I've ever reviewed you before, either, so...doubly exciting!
Anyway, time for a review? Hope you don't mind if it's scattered; I may, you know, feel the need to get up and dance at random intervals. ^_~
"SUM UP" LINES AND TACIT INFORMATION: You had a really cool first line- about the alien breath? That caught my attention, and it's true. That's what it would look like to a small child.
However, then you went into a paragraph starting with this sentence: "Jimothy Sager sat next to his mother's bed in Saint Christopher's Hospital near his hometown."
I call these sorts of sentences "sum-ups". Beginning writers use these a lot because they haven't quite gotten a feel for what readers can be expected to figure out on their own. [I have this problem in the opposite- I assume that everyone knows in-depth everything I'm talking about.]
Problem is, we can assume from the first line that this is taking place in someplace that has to do with health and disease, and we can probably guess from the mother's dialogue that the guy's name is Jim. That's all that we really need to know, right?
By taking out "sum-ups", you leave a lot more room for personal-ness with your reader. You know, how your reader gets into the world through immersion? They can glean a lot more information than you think from character interactions, and the things that they learn from example tend to 'stick' better.
You know how it's really hard to read a history textbook composed of dates and remember them all, but battle details in a fiction novel stay with you for a while? That's basically the gist of this whole ramble.
BOYS DON'T CRY: Guys have strange social beliefs and customs that have carried over for hundreds of years- one of these is the stigma about crying in front of other people. It's 'girly', it's 'soft', it's whatever. I'm not quite sure. The point is- most male characters will be hesitant about crying openly in front of others, because it's seen as effeminate.
So- honestly, I don't quite care how much of a mama's boy Jim is. He's not going to rest his head on a friend's shoulder and weep, because that's not quite what guys do. Right? ^_~
___
Feel free to PM me if you have any questions- I'd be honored to come back and take a second look. See you around, Kel! |
_________________
You can build a throne with bayonets, but you can't sit on it for very long.
- Boris Yeltsin |
|
| Back to top |
|
Lilith
Senior Writer
Gender:
Age: 15
Joined: 22 Apr 2007
Posts: 222
Reviews: 34
Country: U.S.
300 Points
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 2:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
I think this is one of the best peices I've read in a while. It flowed really well and the discription was amazing though I do have to agree with Sam on one point. Boys really don't cry. At least not a lot. I mean, I know a lot of gys and i see them on a day to day to day basis but you don't catch a guy crying openly.
Personally, I really really loved how you decribed the scene at the hospital. Just the way the dialogue and the actions all worked together was amazing. |
_________________
Duffy -- "Watch out for Jesse, he wants what he can't have."
Emily -- "Oh boy, he can have me."
Duffy -- "Figures..." |
|
| Back to top |
|
Kel
Senior Writer
Gender:
Age: 26
Joined: 20 Oct 2006
Posts: 181
Reviews: 46
300 Points
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 10:08 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Squallz: Thanks! You can bet there'll be conflicts!
Alainna: Thank you! I added in a bit of dialogue to Alex. I'll put it in as soon as I'm done here.
Shadow: I'm not sure about adding more emotion or not. I think the emotional stage is pretty well set. I don't want to dwell too much on the sadness of the hospital scene or the funeral because everyone knows they're sad. I wanted more interaction between Jim and Alice than a play-by-play of his thoughts and feelings. The dash will be added, but I don't think all the commas are needed. Thank you for critiquing it even though the subject matter isn't your thing. And thanks for trusting me when I said that it wasn't mentioned here!
Sam: Maybe if you give a few examples of how I can condense the sum-ups into something else, it might be a little more helpful. As it is, I don't really get what you're saying. The bits that you mention seem necessary to me. Jim's crying is going to stay. He is an effeminate boy and when a boy is ten years old and his mother dies, I don't care if you're fifteen or fifty, you're going to cry, boy or not.
Lilith: Do you see a lot of boys whose mothers have died every day? In the past year I've seen a lot of people die and everyone, from ten year old boys up to those in their sixties, have bawled their eyes out. Jim's crying on Donovan's shoulder is going to have to stay in the story. It really dictates how close the boys are, and the fact that Alice mentions Donovan specifically.
Thanks everyone for their critiques! I'll probably have more on Friday or Saturday! |
_________________
Write from the heart and nothing can go wrong. It's when you write from the wallet that the feeling goes away. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Sam
axis of evil, BRB
Epic Novelist
Gender:
Age: 15
Joined: 12 Dec 2004
Posts: 4909
Reviews: 1251
Country: 'mreeka
326 Points
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 12:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
Sure! I shall try to explain...it's note exactly the easiest thing to, as you see. XD
Sum-ups are things you don't need. You don't need to tell us the character's name right away, and you don't need to tell us where he is. That stuff can be figured out in context, right? If you leave that stuff in there, it gets a little repetitive.
Think of it this way- you don't give out your full name, address, political affiliation, and birth weight the first time you meet someone. You give that information out over time, as the other person gets to know you better. Same with stories- we don't know your characters yet, so we need to gradually get acclimated to them.
So! *wags finger* No sum-ups for Kel! ^_~
Ach...crying. I take it I have your permission to ramble? I can't ultimately change what you do with your story, but I'll try to sway you. I've pretty strong opinions on this matter...probably annoying, yes? XD
Anyway- I've this character whom I love very much- Addy? I ramble about him all the time.
He's slightly- how you would say in modern terms- 'flamboyant'. Complete drama queen, the whole shtick. He has two major breakdowns within the plotlinel; the first where his twin sister dies and the second where his darling Smart goes ballistic and roughs him up.
The first time, he's quite young (a little older than Jim) and cries very subtly in a back hallway of his school with Liberty, who is a product of her times and is a slight bit uncomfortable with it.
The second, I think, can be summed up with this:
| Quote: |
He sat, motionless, for two days on the little silk rug in the middle of Upton's floor, legs against his chest, breathing slowly.
Upton went to class and came back, went to dinner and came back- went to sleep and lay awake for hours, waiting for Adelais to do something. He watched his split lip scab over and his cheek swell, something akin to watching paint dry.
And after three days, he said, "I'm terribly hungry."
Upton bid the servants in the hallway to fetch him something- something simple. They brought up a roll with butter, little wisps of steam coming from the split down the center. He sat it down carefully on the rug and watched Adelais pick it apart with his fingers, taking mental notes as though he were menagerie animal.
He brought a piece to his mouth, fingers shaking. It dropped and rolled over on the carpet, spilling agonizing amounts of crumbs- Upton pulled his forceps from the armoire and picked the pieces up one by one.
Adelais simply buried his face in his hands and let his shoulders heave. |
Eh, so, my chracters are freaks. Why did I show you Upton gone mad over bread crumbs?
First off, Adelais is rather close to Upton. Very close. In modern terms, he would probably be Addy's boyfriend- and yet, he can't quite bring himself to cry round Upton, who is a nurturer/caretaker but is, as you see, a little batty.
Second, this is a highly unconventional crying scene- not in feeling, but in the way I presented it. I had weird characters and the whole self-starvation, and strange details that keep it a little more surreal than simply laying his head on Upton's chest and sobbing.
Why would this be bad? Because this is Victorian Boston, in a boy's Christian school. It's all about "Little men, blah blah, masochism, blah blah." And simply because they're wearing a few extra layers of clothing doesn't make it that far removed from the modern day- surely, you've heard guys ramble on and on about stupid things, worrying that they'll "look gay".
See what I mean? You might still think that the 'mother' thing justifies open crying, but trust me, ten-year-old boys are the cruelest little chauvinists this Earth has ever beheld. "Gay" is not so much an adjective as an epithet, and "you look like a girl" is enough to warrant homicide.
Adelais has lost everyone it is possible to lose, and yet he can't bring himself to cry, unless in private.
So. My rant. If you don't do anything, at least I hope it was somewhat coherent reading...? ^_~
*waits patiently for Friday* |
_________________
You can build a throne with bayonets, but you can't sit on it for very long.
- Boris Yeltsin |
|
| Back to top |
|
Misty
Speaker of the Forum
Gender:
Age: 19
Joined: 17 Jan 2005
Posts: 814
Reviews: 493
Country: United States
300 Points
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 12:55 am Post subject: |
|
|
Oliver Twist, Treasures of the Snow, The Good Son, The Secret Garden. Look around a bit--this idea is taken. Not only has it been taken, but it's been done better, by mad professionals, who, like you, know that it is a good idea--however overused. But after the blockbuster that is Jersey Girl, this idea's just about done. I mean for goodness' sakes, George Lucas used it in Star Wars, episode III, for perhaps the most anti-climatic death since that Hut in episode VI.
Point being made? This idea- mom is dying- is overused.
Your descriptions are good. A few of them are outstanding. No less than I would expect for someone of your age. But the cliches! I'm telling you, the thing was a nightmare of lush hair and thick sobs.
This is all right. You can use this idea, but the trick is to make it your own. Change descriptions, strange illnesses, weird names...I really don't care. Just make it interesting.
You'll note in Sam's description, above, that both characters are gay. That's grand. Gay characters are excellent. However, what you're doing, from preliminary line 1,
| Quote: |
| PG-13 for content. If homosexuality offends you, please do not read this novel. |
--- is slapping your reader in the face with homoxexuality. It's not good to do that. Not just with homosexuality, but with heterosexuality, or nymphomania, or anything involving sexuality.
Why?
For the same reason you don't slap a friend in the face. It's rude.
Also, you do a thing in this book that we call INFODUMP. You're shoving a whole lot of information on the reader at one time. This is bad, because in fact your reader is quite smart and will get things on his own, if left to it.
Besides that, this story is excellent--it's well-written. Your grammar is decent (however, you lack commas in places, a careful read-through will settle that).
I will probably continue reading this, however. No matter what I said before, this story is intriguing. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
Kel
Senior Writer
Gender:
Age: 26
Joined: 20 Oct 2006
Posts: 181
Reviews: 46
300 Points
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 2:51 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Misty wrote: |
However, what you're doing, from preliminary line 1, --- is slapping your reader in the face with homoxexuality. It's not good to do that. Not just with homosexuality, but with heterosexuality, or nymphomania, or anything involving sexuality.
Why?
For the same reason you don't slap a friend in the face. It's rude.
|
To bypass the rest of the review and get right to this ...
I put the disclaimer there because a moderator suggested it.
So feel free to go and complain to them. I'm only following the rules. |
_________________
Write from the heart and nothing can go wrong. It's when you write from the wallet that the feeling goes away. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Misty
Speaker of the Forum
Gender:
Age: 19
Joined: 17 Jan 2005
Posts: 814
Reviews: 493
Country: United States
300 Points
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 4:04 am Post subject: |
|
|
Mod or no mod, the slap is there. And I'm not complaining to anyone, merely suggesting. That's what this website is for. I've been here for about three years and I've learned that listening to the advice given, rather than arguing, will take you far in your writing.
Have a happy night!
~Misty |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
Gadi.
O FOR VICTORY!
Speaker of the Forum
Gender:
Age: 15
Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 989
Reviews: 394
Country: under the covers
300 Points
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 4:17 am Post subject: |
|
|
The opening didn't really catch my attention. I am not looking for intense action, just for some interesting line or subject. "Alien breath" is excellent, but after that, I don't know.
"There's something the matter and I don't think they're going to let me go home."
think you should separate this into two sentences, that way it won't sound like Alice is rushing through the sentence. You have built the image of peace and comfort and sadness, but when you put this sentence you add nervousness and a slight terror to the style and pace.
I don't really understand the baby breath thing.
It was good, I guess. Not the best. But it was certainly...uh...interesting sometimes, sad, but the sadness seemed on the surface, and not that realistic. Add some more emotions by describing the emotions more artistically, less literally.
Also, some parts were kind of awkward. When the mother and son are talking, some of the mother's dialogue feels unreal. She's dying, right? But as I pointed out, her dialogue changes style and feeling quite often. Also in the funeral, the father's fialogue is pretty awkward as well. |
_________________
my world isn't only beautiful
it is so far away |
|
| Back to top |
|
Griffinkeeper
Storybook Godfather
Epic Novelist
Gender:
Age: 20
Joined: 02 Apr 2005
Posts: 3810
Reviews: 665
Country: USA
300 Points
|
| Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 10:04 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Misty wrote: |
Mod or no mod, the slap is there. And I'm not complaining to anyone, merely suggesting. That's what this website is for. I've been here for about three years and I've learned that listening to the advice given, rather than arguing, will take you far in your writing.
Have a happy night!
~Misty |
To clarify: the note is not part of the story, merely a warning about it. Any further comments on this note should be differed to a member of Big Brother, NOT the author. |
_________________
I retired from Big Brother on November 11th.
On November 12th, I started showing up and having good ideas again.
What is wrong with me? |
|
| Back to top |
|
Snoink
Snuggly
Writer of Legend
Gender:
Age: 20
Joined: 02 Apr 2005
Posts: 8649
Reviews: 2127
Country: USA
981 Points
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
Aw shucks. You took it down. 
Well, I'm going to lock it as it's not really a story now, but if you want to post it back up, feel free to PM me and I can unlock it for you! |
_________________
"So, Obama calls McCain erratic. Well, I call Obama a squirrel." -- Rush Limbaugh
Video Critiques by Yours Truly.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
