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This thread was created on June 7, 2007
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Prelude to: Harestin, The Tale Of
Harestin, The Tale Of - 2
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Harestin, The Tale Of - 1

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2007 7:48 pm    Post subject: Harestin, The Tale Of - 1 Reply with quote

Chapter One. EDITED! YAY! Finaly, takes me so long.

I still haven't decided if I'm going to change the Harestins first speech.

Also, I am currently working on Covter's home. It really is not detailed enough. May take me awhile though.

%%%%%%%

Harestin, The Tale Of

Chapter I

19 years later.

It was a beautiful, bright morning and the sun was just barely above the horizon. It was Spring. Birds were hopped on the wet ground in search of worms to sate their appetite, others chattering happily in the budding treetops.

That is, until the terrifying bellows erupting from a being, scared them away in a rush.

A hare was leaping along in a tattered tunic, carrying a grain sack with one hand and swinging a large stick at all and sundry with the other.

Yelling fearsomely he turned his head and struck out at a fern, but the weight of the grain made him lose his balance, cannoning him straight into a tree.

“Yowch!”

Then stumbling along he continued to the market, muttering indignantly as he went. “Rotten guy! Come up behind me and smack me when I’m not looking do yeh? I’ll show you!” With that he swung mightily at an overhanging branch and succeeded only in breaking his stick and numbing his hand.

“Ooh, it’s a cruel world when a chap gets sent to the market and has to fight through hundreds of warriors twenty feet tall with swords of stone.”

On he continued, talking to himself about all the injustices of life and looking for a new stick.

Upon arriving at the marketplace Harestin’s eyes skimmed over the many stalls and their owners, shouting out about their goods.

Slowly he turned his head surveying all that was going on. Ferrets under broken down hutches haggled with rabbits over blankets and other wares, as hedgehogs plodded over the cobblestone street, pushing rickety carts.

Stepping up to the gate that led to the mill, he jounced to a stop when his eyes alighted on a hare.

A particularly pretty hare. She was on her knees making furrows in the mill's garden; her long ears carefully folded back, out of the way.

Harestin swallowed, and opened the squeaky gate, which announced his presence.

Telina turned her hazel eyes to see who it was and smiled when she saw it was Harestin. He was a regular customer for the mill, and he always had heroic adventures to tell that he had made up himself. Mostly about him too, she thought with a laugh.

Harestin started the usual conversation with a particularly obvious statement. “I’ve got another sack of grain for the mill.”

“Okay, bring it right in. Have you made up another chapter for your story?”

“Yes,” answered Harestin as he stepped through the doorway.

“Will you tell it to me while the grain is grinding?”

“Sure.”

And so, for the next hour Harestin sat in the garden with Telina, his words painting a picture in her mind.

After the grain was ground Harestin decided to take a walk around town, before heading home.

His feet made a slight thumping as he walked over to a darkish alleyway. Harestin had always liked alleyways, because they were dark and mysterious deals went on in them. They were also a private place to think, on the main road it was always hard to think. This alleyway was his particular favorite because his best friend lived just a little ways in.

Covter Crow. Harestin liked Covter Crow because he had all sorts of interesting things, most of which didn’t have much use. But it was great fun to sit and look at the amazing variety of things, while he told you about how he had gotten them from his journeys.

Harestin’s heart leapt when he saw that Covter Crow was in. Covter was gone a lot on journeys to here and there, so it wasn’t real often that Harestin got to see him.

“Hares! How are you ya Longjumper? I’ve got something new from my journey that I think you’ll like!”

“Hello Covter, I’m doing just fine, I had to take some grain to the mill, that’s in this sack. What’s in the pouch?”

“What I’m going to show you.”

And with that Covter opened the pouch and took out a scroll, which he plopped on the table between Hares and himself.

It was a map.

Harestin loved maps. They were always covered with mountains and little circles on lines, which meant trees. Another neat thing that Harestin loved was the Legend. It told which signs were which. Two lines going across another two other lines further apart was a ferry spot. The other two lines was a river. Where the mountains ended and more continued afterward, there was a pass. And there were always towns and villages on a map. The best part though, was if there were castles. Castles were always neat. Set way up on a cliff or deep in the wilderness, castles always carried mysteriousness about them. What if it was an evil maniac’s castle?

The interesting thing was that there was a castle on this map.

The name below said, “An Evil Place, Beware!”

That got Harestins’ attention.

More importantly it said that this was the place where a so-called evil ruler had set himself up a kingdom using The Medal Of Prosperity.

The Medal Of Prosperity. Just think. What if he were to go adventuring, as he had always wanted to, and bring back The Medal Of Prosperity?

It would be great! Everyone would be cheering for him. A great banquet would be prepared. Harestin decided that he was the one that was destined. He had to go. To save the town!

Snapping out of his reverie, Harestin decided it wouldn’t hurt to talk to Covter for an hour or so before heading home. As it turned out it was a little more than Harestin had planned on, but it wasn’t as if there was something he terribly needed to be home for. Besides, he had plenty of time to get there anyway.

“It was great seeing you Covter, but I guess I had better head back.”

“Okay, but take the map as a gift, I don’t really need it, can’t read very well ya know.”

“Are you sure?”

“Of course I’m sure lad, don’t I know this land like the back of my head?”

Harestin was about to comment that Covter couldn’t see the back of his head, but thought better of it.

“Oh, yeah, Thanks Covter!”

And with that Harestin set out for home, his thoughts filled with the map and questing.

%%%%%%%%%%

Hares is pronounced Harris, if anybody wondered.



Last edited by RatchetWriter on Sat Nov 10, 2007 4:39 pm; edited 4 times in total
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2007 12:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

"To any passerby it would be a highly irregular sight that came to your eyes." I believe, though I'm not sure why exactly it would be their instead of your in this sentence. I felt like there wasn't much sentence variety in this, and some of this read too bland for my taste. However, the idea for this was certainly interesting, although it did sound sort of like Redwall by Brian Jacques, especially because of Harestin's personality...

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2007 2:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey bro looks like you have done some work on Harestin since I last saw it. I found a few spots you might want to consider.

First of all:

Quote:
And with that he swung mightily at an overhanging branch and succeeded only in breaking his stick and numbing his hand


You don't need that 'And' at the beginning you could also do without the second one too.

With that he swung mightily at an overhanging branch, succeeding only in breaking his stick and numbing his hand.

Quote:
Ferrets under broken down hutches haggled with rabbits over blankets and other wares, as hedgehogs plodded over the cobblestone street, pushing rickety carts in front of them.


Here you can drop the 'in front of them' because where else would the hedgehogs be pushing their carts?

Quote:
A particularly pretty hare. Named Telina. She was on her knees picking strawberries in the mills garden; her long ears carefully folded back, out of the way.


At the beginning of your story, you set the season as spring. How then is Talina picking strawberries? They don't ripen until the middle of summer. You might want to think about changing that, maybe have the pretty hare girl either getting her garden ready for planting or another task.
You also need to insert a apostrophe (mill's) to show possession. (Those crazy apostrophes bug me too Smile

I like how the gate announces his presence.

Quote:
Mostly about him to, she thought with a laugh.


too

Quote:
Telina turned her hazel eyes to see who it was and smiled when she saw it was Harestin, he was a regular customer for the mill, and he always had heroic adventures to tell that he had made up himself.


This sentence is rather long. Try breaking it in half.

Quote:
Harestin always had liked alleyways, because they were dark and mysterious deals went on in them.


This needs rewording. Try 'Harestin had always liked alleyways, because dark and mysterious deals went on in them.'
Also this sentence is telling readers that Harestin liked alleyways rather then showing them how and why Harestin found alleyways intriguing. Insert a dark deal that he sees maybe? It's up to you.

Quote:
They were also a private place to think if you going somewhere, on the main road it was always hard to think.


You can leave this out and you won't lose the meaning of the sentence.

Quote:
This alleyway was his particular favorite because his best friend lived just a little ways in.

Covter Crow. Harestin liked Covter Crow because he had all sorts of interesting things, most of which didn’t have much use. But it was great fun to sit and look at the amazing variety of things, while he told you about how he had gotten them from his journeys.
Harestin’s heart leapt when he saw that Covter Crow was in. Covter was gone a lot on journeys to here and there, so it wasn’t real often that Harestin got to see him.


Covter sounds like a cool character. I suggest though, that you use more imagery as he approaches and enters his friend's house. Or is it a shop? How can he tell that Covter is in? A sign out or is the bird out taking in some sun? I have all of these questions that you could answer by adding some description.

Quote:
Hares loved maps


Here I was confused. Is this sentence speaking about hares in general or Harestin's name abbreviated?

Quote:
More importantly it said that this was the place where a so-called evil ruler had set himself up a kingdom using The Medal Of Prosperity.
The Medal Of Prosperity. Just think! What if he were to go adventuring, as he had always wanted to, and bring back The Medal Of Prosperity?
It would be great! Everyone would be cheering for him! A great banquet would be prepared! Harestin decided that he was the one that was destined. He had to go! To save the town!


Here there are a few too many exclaimation marks! It kind of overwelms the reader! Don't you think?! Smile

Whoa, I just looked back on this critique. Sorry if it is a little severe. I am glad that I am writing this out here, on this site, almost a thousand miles away from you instead of reading over your shoulder. I'd probably be getting pummeled right now. Smile

Write On!

Your bro

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2007 3:01 am    Post subject: !!!!!!!!!!!!! Reply with quote

This is what I have been looking for, a good story involving animals as the main character. I love it. I love the idea , the plot, the mysteriousness of it all. Man, please opm me when you write more. I am complatly addectid. Is the rabbit going to go on an adventure, now that is an original thought! THis story is abosolute gold. I hope this storry works out for you!

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 1:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bian - Thanks I think that is right, it sounds better anyway.

Yes I have realized that the first time you hear Harestin talk it sounds a bit to much like Brian Jacques, later though he talks differently, I am considering the changes I"m going to make to that first part.

While it may be slowish, have you read the Prelude? It might help.

Shireling - Thanks bro, I shall take note of those things.

And no, it wasn't harsh, I find that it was encouraging if anything. What's harsh is if someone says, "yuck, delete this" Laughing

Anyway.

DragonWriter - Nice name.

Your post was VERY encouraging. I will be sure to notify you when the next piece comes. Very Happy

Thanks everyone, and more crits welcome!
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very good! One quick thing is you might add some more conversation between Harestin and Covter. To me the time at the crow's house (or nest or whatever) seemed a bit rushed. I too think it did sound a bit like Brian Jacques, but that's not all bad, I like his writing (i've read all his books but one of the newest ones that i saw at Barns and Noble Razz)! It was in some ways different though, so it's not like your copying or anything. Good job and keep it up. PM me too when there's more if you don't mind.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are some random things that i thought of. Things NOT to do in this story.

1. Humanize: don't make Harestin a human with big ears and feet, make him a hare that can talk. In other words, leave him as much like a hare as possible. Make him be able to jump higher, run faster, and hear better than most. That would also provide some fun different characters (like squirrels who can climb all kinds of stuff). Every animal in nature has certain characteristics that help it to survive (except for maybe chickens). Try to portray those different attributes in your varied animal characters.

2. Stereotype: Brian Jacques does this a whole lot.
a. Characters: The hares in Redwall all seem mostly the same to me. So are all the moles alike, shrews alike, and even all the warrior mice are stereotyipical! This causes boringness and is just plain dumb and unrealistic.

b. Plots: Ever read a Redwall book, and then read another one right afterwords? In some cases there seems to be no difference except for names. You won't have a problem with this one though unless you write a second book or make this one too much like one of Jacques' books.

c. Racism: This is my worst pet peeve against Jacques writing. ALL ferets are bad, and ALL mice are good. There are only two types of beast, good or bad. I've only found two cases different; one in which a rat turned good, and the other a wildcat. If you don't do this you will make things a lot more realistic, a lot more interesting, and the story will be easier to work with (you can have some traitors and inbetween guys).

3. Size: How comes it that in Redwall a wildcat is MAX twice the size of a mouse? If you make sizes more realistic, then you can make things a whole lot more interesting (battles with giant creatures vs. smaller are quite fun!).


Well, I know your not copying Redwall or anything, but these are just some things you should try to avoid. I tried (and never finished) a book like this and hopefully learned some things that could help you. My main suggestion (and this would require a LOT of re-thinking and re-writing Sad ) is that you drop the 'humanness' of this story. What I mean by dropping the humanness is this: get rid of all clothes, houses, gardens, mills, carts, markets, and all that stuff. Have Harestin live in a burrow and the crow in a nest. This would be quite hard, especially you having already started the story, but that's why it's just a suggestion. The plot would still work but you'd just have to rewrite some things. This would be hard i know, but i highly suggest you do it. It would separate your story from one of Jacques' even more and would make things more original and interesting.

Good job!

-Greenie

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks greenjay.

I agree to most of the things that you mentioned, I already have a few chapters written of this story and I'm trying to follow most of those things.

However I don't think I'm going to change the human buildings thing, I've already thought way down the line on stuff like that.

I am going to take your advice however, I'm already trying to do that, I don't want people to think I ripped off Brian Jacques.

And er, I whisper in a small voice, I need a bad guy plot. Embarassed

I have a few chapters, but I just can't decide what the bad guys goal is.
I'm just kind of tired of the whole *dominate the world thing*.

So I would greatly appreciate ideas and comments on that.

I'll be sure to post you on the next section. I don't think it will take to long.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What have we here?

Quote:
It was a beautiful, bright morning and the sun was just barely above the horizon. There were strips of snow all over and the ground was wet. It was spring. Some birds were hopping on the ground in search of worms to sate their appetite, while others chattered happily in the budding treetops.


It annoys me that you have to tell us it is Spring (you capitalize seasons.) As a storyteller, you're supposed to create an image of Spring. Birds hopping around snow is definitely a winter sort of thing.

Also,
Quote:
Some birds were hopping on the ground in search of worms to sate their appetite, while others chattered happily in the budding treetops.


This sentence is very non-committal, "some birds are doing this, some birds are doing that." It seems to imply that there are other groups of birds doing other things.

Quote:
That is, until they flew away in a startled rush because of the terrifying bellows erupting from below. To any passerby it would be a highly irregular sight that came to your eyes.


Repeat after me, "cause then effect." You gave us the effect first, instead of the cause. This causes confusion in the sentence.

Also, kill the passerby sentence. There are no witnesses to watch it, so who cares? The real purpose of this sentence was to say "this is unusual." Trust me, it is not unusual for birds to be startled by large noises.

Quote:
A hare was leaping along in a tattered tunic, carrying a grain sack with one hand and swinging a large stick at all and sundry with the other.
Yelling fearsomely he turned his head and struck out at a fern, but the weight of the grain made him lose his balance, cannoning him straight into a tree.

“Yowch!”

Then stumbling along he continued to the market, muttering indignantly as he went. “Rotten guy! Come up behind me and smack me when I’m not looking do yeh? I’ll show you!” And with that he swung mightily at an overhanging branch and succeeded only in breaking his stick and numbing his hand.

“Ooh, it’s a cruel world when a chap gets sent to the market and has to fight through hundreds of warriors twenty feet tall with swords of stone.”
On he continued, talking to himself about all the injustices of life and looking for a new stick.


I suppose this is where we cue the laugh track and laugh at the senile hare?

Quote:
~~~~~


What is the point of this? You continue right on with the story, so this might as well not exist.

Quote:
Upon arriving at the marketplace Harestin’s eyes alighted on the many stalls and their owners, shouting out about their goods.
Slowly he turned his head surveying all that was going on. Ferrets under broken down hutches haggled with rabbits over blankets and other wares, as hedgehogs plodded over the cobblestone street, pushing rickety carts in front of them.


I think alighted is a bad word to use. This guy is scanning the area, alighted implies that he is looking at something specific.

Quote:
Stepping up to the gate that led to the mill, he jounced to a stop when his eyes alighted on a hare.
A particularly pretty hare. Named Telina. She was on her knees picking strawberries in the mills garden; her long ears carefully folded back, out of the way.
Harestin swallowed, and opened the squeaky gate, which announced his presence.


Yuck. Just yuck. Let me be more specific.

Quote:
A particularly pretty hare. Named Telina.


Delete this. You can tell us her name after you've described her.

Quote:
Named Telina.


THIS IS NOT A SENTENCE NOR WILL IT EVER BE! Don't do that again.

Quote:
Harestin swallowed, and opened the squeaky gate, which announced his presence.


Wait, the gate announced him? You should indicate that Telina heard the noise of the gate opening.

Quote:
Telina turned her hazel eyes to see who it was and smiled when she saw it was Harestin, he was a regular customer for the mill, and he always had heroic adventures to tell that he had made up himself. Mostly about him to, she thought with a laugh.
Harestin started the usual conversation with a particularly obvious statement. “I’ve got another sack of grain for the mill.”


Allow me the pleasure of re-writing this to my satisfaction.

Quote:
Telina turned to see Harestin and smiled.

"I've got another sack of grain for the mill," Harestin said.


You need nothing more than that. Don't tell us their history.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ahem, Griffin.

I appreciate the long in depth crit.

I think I will follow some of what you said.

However.

I feel that you are telling me to write in a different style than I use.

You talk about my first sentence being winter? There are strips of snow, not snow everywhere. And the ground is wet and mushy. Haven't you seen that before? Maybe you live in a different part of the world and the climate is different there.

Quote:
This sentence is very non-committal, "some birds are doing this, some birds are doing that." It seems to imply that there are other groups of birds doing other things.


Precisly, is there something wrong with that?

cause after effect. I think I understand that, maybe I can fix it to my prefrences.

Personally I want the passerby sentence in there. So there is no passerby, who cares that there aren't any passerby? It sounds good don't you think? It's part of my style.

Quote:
I suppose this is where we cue the laugh track and laugh at the senile hare?


Is this supposed to be sarcasm or approval or what?

~~~~~~~

The point is I wanted a rest in there. My stories have rests often, because I find that the phone rings or your mom wants you to stop reading ALL the time, and you're never at a good stopping point.

Alighted.

Agreed. I think I'll use something like skimmed.

Why should I tell her name after I describe her? I see no reason to wait.
The reason I stick in the oh-so-disgusting-sentence is that's the way I read my books. It's a movie in your head, not a slideshow or something. It's to make emphasis and to slow the reader down and realize that Harestin obviously cares for this particular being.

Ahem, sorry to be mean or rude, but do you not picture the book in your head?
The gate anounces his presence. Can't you imagine it squeaking and anouncing that he's there?

And about the last thing.

I felt that the bit of description made you know the characters more (and thus care about them more) and not slow down the story in the least.

Simply, why would she smile at Harestin if she didn't see him regularly and have something to smile about? Perhaps shes just being polite, I guess it could be.

Sorry if this seemed like a crit on your crit, but I feel the need to explain why I do some things the way I do.

I did however enjoy the somewhat harsh crit, it pointed out more things that did need to be changed and I enjoyed it. I will notify you when the next section comes so you can rip it up too. Very Happy
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, I admit. The un-human thing was a bit too much this far into things.

I have an idea for the bad guy plot! The bad guy (maybe another hare, that might make things interesting) made up the map, making everyone believe he had the medal. He then (about half or less of the way through the book) captures/tries to capture Harestin. The bad guy doesn't have the medal of prosperity but...

1. Knows that it is locked away in some guarded dugeon and forces Harestine to get it for him (maybe by capturing Telina). And then Harestin has to steal it back from the bad guy.

or

2. Doesn't know where it is and thinks Harestine might know. He doesn't (or might) so the bad guy forces him to find it for him. It would end up about the same as the first version but would probably be a little longer.

That's my idea! If you don't like it just say so, cause I always have more ideas!!! Razz

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 1:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Thanks! I didn't really think anyone would want to give me their ideas. Very Happy

I might use the first one, I really like your idea of the made up map. It would fit in perfectly because my story says An Evil Place Beware! just to get your attention.

Thank you again, maybe my story can get rolling now! Very Happy

*goes off excited and thinking about Harestin*
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 6:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
You talk about my first sentence being winter? There are strips of snow, not snow everywhere. And the ground is wet and mushy. Haven't you seen that before? Maybe you live in a different part of the world and the climate is different there.


I think that by focusing on the snow, you make it appear much colder than it really is. It may be something you want to change.

Quote:
Quote:

This sentence is very non-committal, "some birds are doing this, some birds are doing that." It seems to imply that there are other groups of birds doing other things.



Precisly, is there something wrong with that?


The problem with it is that it can distract the reader if it isn't important.

Quote:
Personally I want the passerby sentence in there. So there is no passerby, who cares that there aren't any passerby? It sounds good don't you think? It's part of my style.


The passerby sentence is bad because it is irrelevant. It's function in a nutshell is to tell the writer what they ought to notice (in this case, that you should notice that the event is unusual.) I believe that it is better to show stuff to your reader than to tell stuff to your reader. It makes the story run very smoothly; essential to turning this story into a movie. The reason I advocate removing non-essential details and words is because it makes the story run a lot smoother. By doing this, you can obtain a movie like feeling without all the effort.

Quote:
Quote:

I suppose this is where we cue the laugh track and laugh at the senile hare?



Is this supposed to be sarcasm or approval or what?


It is my response to seeing the protagonist for the first time. If this is not the intended effect, then you should consider editing that paragraph.

Quote:
~~~~~~~

The point is I wanted a rest in there. My stories have rests often, because I find that the phone rings or your mom wants you to stop reading ALL the time, and you're never at a good stopping point.


This is preventing you from engrossing your reader. What you are doing is shooting your story in the foot. A good story is supposed to make the reader so engrossed that they do not want to put your story down.

Trust me, if the interruption is important enough then your reader will put down the book. Putting down the book isn't bad when it is done under duress. This is because the reader will be so anxious to go back to uninterrupted reading that they will finish their chores (in record time!) and rush back to finish your epic novel.

Shooting for anything lower in our novels is to limit how good your writing will be.

Quote:
Why should I tell her name after I describe her? I see no reason to wait.
The reason I stick in the oh-so-disgusting-sentence is that's the way I read my books. It's a movie in your head, not a slideshow or something. It's to make emphasis and to slow the reader down and realize that Harestin obviously cares for this particular being.


I find that it is much easier to attach a name to a description, instead of the other way around. A name means much more when you have images all ready attached to it.

As for the disgusting sentence-

When I read that sentence, I saw red. I had to rewrite that portion several times just to make it acceptable for public reading. To be fair, you did make his interest clear, but only by BEATING IT INTO MY HEAD WITH A MALLET! As an author, you are here to write a story that is entertaining. Instead of writing your story, you are dumbing down your story, as if we, the readers, are too stupid to understand what you are writing.

This just makes my blood boil.

What more, there are many ways to achieve the same thing without insulting your readers intelligence. These methods are all possible by using the magic of "showing" instead of "telling."

You can emphasize it through description and dialog. Do not try to emphasize something by changing the rules of writing.

Quote:
Named Telina.


This violates the rules of sentence structure. Every subject needs a subject and a verb.

"Okay."

Is an exception, but you will notice that in a story, we encourage you to put:

"Okay," he said.

Notice the not-so-subtle subject and verb.

I hope this clarifies why I was not so pleased with those portions of the story.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah! Thank you! You have made your point.

I like most of the changes you suggest.

Also, I try to show, it's hard.

Thank you for clarifying your opinons, I will have to do some editing soon.

*nods head to the greater experience of Griffin.*
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